Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

hanselman.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 102 posts

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#41

Post by abritinthebay »

mgkimsal wrote: post #35
kimdotcom wrote: post #30

Alot if shitty attitudes about Wordpress here. If it is so awful, why is it on over 25% of sites? It has helped alot of people make alot of money, and continues to do so.

"If it is so awful, why is it on over 25% of sites?" If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? WP is 'free', has a low barrier to entry, and for many years non-developers were able to relatively easily add custom functionality (sometimes done well, but often security and performance nightmares). A lot of people make a lot of money from selling illegal drugs, or fatty foods, or…

> If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year?

This is an amazingly good comparison because in both cases the initial assumption is wrong.

Just like WP, McDonalds is not bad for you intrinsically. It’s poor discipline and usage that causes problems.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#43

Post by abritinthebay »

Theodores wrote: post #26
stephenr wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could take “C#” out of that sentence and still be accurate. Wordpress is not and I imagine never will be anywhere close to “modern design patterns”. It’s not even close to old design patterns, unless Heinz has a namesake software design pattern. Wordpress uses practices that were considered a bad idea a decade or more ago, and still refuses to change.

For clients and writing actual content nothing beats Wordpress. The editor is great and a lot of people have used it before so, from a developer point of view, I believe that with Wordpress you should give people what they want. The alternative of demanding they use some 'better' CMS means that the content never gets written or updated. However, not to disrespect the work that has gone into Wordpress, how hard can it…

> how hard can it be

Hard.

Very hard. Especially because you first have to pick something as well installed and supported on hosts as PHP to even get traction. Good luck there.

Then you need to be at least as good in most or all features on launch to get any mindshare. Hope you have a few years to work on this side project before you release...

There have been plenty of attempts and of them all Ghost is about the only one to be taken seriously it seems and it’s niche at best (and not yet at the same level of features or ease of use & configuration).

So yeah, the answer is hard. Harder than you think.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#44

Post by mgkimsal »

armandososa wrote: post #40
mgkimsal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If it is so awful, why is it on over 25% of sites?" If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? WP is 'free', has a low barrier to entry, and for many years non-developers were able to relatively easily add custom functionality (sometimes done well, but often security and performance nightmares). A lot of people make a lot of money from selling illegal drugs, or fatty foods, or…

WP is really extensible. The way hooks and filters work and the way they are used trough the codebase allows you to completely alter and change virtually every aspect of the software. That includes everything from the admin UI to the processing and displaying of content. None of the modern alternatives are remotely as powerful and versatile as WP is.

if you're a developer, or have a development team, loads of options are even more extensible and versatile. and those options would all come with more flexible deployment, testing and scalability options.

if you're not big in to development, you're reliant on a plethora of plugins, and you need to hope that the dozens of plugins you tie together know how to play nicely together. I'd run in to multiple situations where poorly built plugins for plugins were hacked on and then conflicted with other plugins - everyone pointed the finger at someone else. and then the standard support line from a couple vendors (these were plugins with paid support, btw) - "disable 100% of all your plugins, then enable them one by one to see where the problem is". Sweet.

And when I tell people I inherited a wp site with just shy of 60 plugins, few people actually believe me. "I would never do that! I would never built anything with more than 4 (substitute with various numbers representing experience levels of people) plugins - that's all anyone ever needs!"

When it works well, it works well. When it doesn't, it's a bloody nightmare.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#45

Post by mgkimsal »

abritinthebay wrote: post #41
mgkimsal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If it is so awful, why is it on over 25% of sites?" If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? WP is 'free', has a low barrier to entry, and for many years non-developers were able to relatively easily add custom functionality (sometimes done well, but often security and performance nightmares). A lot of people make a lot of money from selling illegal drugs, or fatty foods, or…

> If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? This is an amazingly good comparison because in both cases the initial assumption is wrong . Just like WP, McDonalds is not bad for you intrinsically. It’s poor discipline and usage that causes problems.

I might go further a bit because large fast food companies engineer the food to be ... addictive in some capacity. And the WP ecosystem is relatively addictive. "Just one more plugin and these 3 problems will be solved!" Per comment above - I inherited a site with around 60 active plugins. The team before just ... added a plugin for every single problem they encountered. Because... point and click? No experience with any other ways of solving problems?

People who've been raised on fast/processed foods, and may never have actually done any cooking themselves, honestly may not even understand the problems with the food they're eating, or what the alternatives are. Yeah, 'home cooking' is more initially expensive (need some basics tools, place to store ingredients, keep them fresh, etc), and certainly more time up front learning how to cook certain things. But... you know what's in the food you've prepared. And you have knowledge and skills that can serve you for a long time.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#46

Post by mgkimsal »

armandososa wrote: post #42
kimdotcom wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jekyll or Django, or a hybrid?

Not even close. That's like saying that the alternative to Photoshop is C++.

That might be a bit harsh. Closer comparison might be photoshop to gimp?

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#47

Post by 52-6F-62 »

mgkimsal wrote: post #44
armandososa wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WP is really extensible. The way hooks and filters work and the way they are used trough the codebase allows you to completely alter and change virtually every aspect of the software. That includes everything from the admin UI to the processing and displaying of content. None of the modern alternatives are remotely as powerful and versatile as WP is.

if you're a developer, or have a development team, loads of options are even more extensible and versatile. and those options would all come with more flexible deployment, testing and scalability options. if you're not big in to development, you're reliant on a plethora of plugins, and you need to hope that the dozens of plugins you tie together know how to play nicely together. I'd run in to multiple situations wher…

Speaking from experience in nation-wide digital media— you're dead spot on.

I have seen sites with 60+ WP plugins enabled. Many outdated, many hacked upon (and poorly, with no documentation). Even the WP instances were modified just slightly and had convoluted build processes that nobody on the current teams could explain (again, with no documentation. Or rather documentation was "TBD" circa 2010).

And all of those WP instances either shared configurations and root style sheets or ran as a multi-site on a single machine with Nginx in front of it only using a mix of Akamai, Cloudflare, and Brightcove to handle some, but not all, non-print media.

The sites were consistently being exploited and having porn uploaded. Issues like that were usually caught quickly enough, but that kind of operation kept the teams busy with patching holes rather than improving performance.

Last I checked their WP sites downloaded 20 Mb of scripts alone on a fresh load, and 6mb thereafter.

Bloody nightmare is right.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#48

Post by giancarlostoro »

mgkimsal wrote: post #46
armandososa wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not even close. That's like saying that the alternative to Photoshop is C++.

That might be a bit harsh. Closer comparison might be photoshop to gimp?

Jekyll is closer to Wordpress but Django is a library / framework so Photoshop to C++ is kinda close, but a little too far.

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#49

Post by egypturnash »

dbwest wrote: post #8
ihsw2 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We were so preoccupied with whether or not we could, we didn't stop to think if we should.

Reminds me of 'Phuby on Phails', Ruby on Rails in PHP...just because. I think the WTFF is about the same (off the charts).

http://adrianzandberg.pl/cobol-on-wheelchair/

Re: The Whole of WordPress Compiled to .NET Core and a NuGet Package with PeachPie

#50

Post by scarface74 »

abritinthebay wrote: post #41
mgkimsal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If it is so awful, why is it on over 25% of sites?" If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? WP is 'free', has a low barrier to entry, and for many years non-developers were able to relatively easily add custom functionality (sometimes done well, but often security and performance nightmares). A lot of people make a lot of money from selling illegal drugs, or fatty foods, or…

> If McDonalds is so bad for you, why do they serve 550 million Big Macs every year? This is an amazingly good comparison because in both cases the initial assumption is wrong . Just like WP, McDonalds is not bad for you intrinsically. It’s poor discipline and usage that causes problems.

There is nothing good for you at McDonalds. Even thier “healthy” options are less healthy and over processed compared to local restaurants.
Post reply on HN