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Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

arstechnica.com

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Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#81

Post by grecy »

maxxxxx wrote: post #70
grecy wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would think an 8.9 sec 1/4 mile is everything you need to know, especially when Elon has said that's the base model and there will be "performance upgrades" that make it faster. If you're not familiar, just google the 1/4 mile time of any fast car you can think of, and then look into how hard it is to go from say 10.5 to 10.0, then 9.9 Obviously I know a lap time needs a lot more than straight line acceleration, bu…

Straight line acceleration is pretty useless on a real track if you don't have the handling in corners. I assume the roadster will be pretty heavy. The Model S is also a beast going straight but cornering is much less fun with it because it's so heavy.

At 10.86 1/4 mile, the P100D is a snail compared to the Roadster 2 at 8.9.

We're talking about the difference between a Cesna and a fighter plane, and then some.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#82

Post by AngryData »

Nobody thought it was unbreakable, just people stopped using the increasingly faster cars on the track because it is dangerous as fuck. I mean just watch the video of it, I wouldn't be going that fast in a video game on that track because it would be so damn easy to fuck up and crash.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#83

Post by cjpb »

kirse wrote: post #33
makmanalp wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who knows nothing about cars, what surprised me was just how much of this was braking right after you accelerate, which in hindsight is obvious given the turns at crazy speeds, but still.

A good eye. One of the biggest lessons taught in any advanced car control course is that the brakes/gas aren't just for stopping/going. By using them to modulate weight transfer you can change grip levels at F/R, adjust vehicle yaw (+/- turning radius), smooth out suspension undulations, etc.

Also remember these cars are built with KERS/DRS:

"During braking, a generator at the front axle converts the car’s kinetic energy into electrical energy. In the split exhaust system, one turbine drives the turbocharger while another converts surplus energy into electrical energy. The braking energy contributes 60 per cent, with the remaining 40 per cent coming from exhaust gas. The recuperated electrical energy is stored temporarily in a lithium-ion battery and feeds an electric motor on demand. “On demand” means: the driver wants to accelerate and calls up the energy at the press of a button. In accordance with the latest regulation changes, the power from the combustion engine is just under 368 kW (500 HP), and the output from the electric motor is well over 294 kW (400 HP)."

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#84

Post by taneq »

jsjohnst wrote: post #77
taneq wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've sometimes thought that it would be a neat addition to a performance car's instrumentation to have a gauge that showed where you were in the traction circle. Didn't the Nissan Skyline GTR have this?

Are you maybe thinking of the front torque gauge? Thats the only gauge I can think of on the classic Skyline GTR that isn’t common on most cars, but that’s still not a traction circle like GP referenced.

I was actually thinking of the Top Gear review of the R34 Skyline, which shows a 2-axis G-meter (so basically the same thing). Not sure if this was ever standard equipment, though, since I can't find reference to it elsewhere.

Source: https://youtu.be/oAp1CXnAqGs?t=50s

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#85

Post by King-Aaron »

vesrah wrote: post #53
maxxxxx wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"What is the significance of Nurburgring?" It's a very long and very tricky track. It has everything: superfast sections, slow sections, steep uphill and downhill, bumps, banking, often wet. If a car does well on this track it will do well almost everywhere. It's called the "green hell". I don't think there is another track worldwide left that can compare.

The Mountain Circuit on Isle of Man.

This is easily some of the craziest racing you're every going to see. There's zero margin for error and it generally highlights this every year.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#86

Post by pwaai »

jacquesm wrote: post #19
pwaai wrote: post #17

5:19 almost seems impossible. I think we will see sub 5 minutes within the next 5 years at this rate. It seems like Lamborghini just gave up in a dick measuring contest. Nurburgring is Porsche's home turf. German's aren't outwardly nationalistic but they take a lot of pride and result orientated bunch. Also ironic that Lambo is practically an Audi. I will buy a porsche instead of a Lambo, this type of effort just sho…

If you think Gran Turismo on a Playstation is preparation for driving a Porsche RS in anger then you probably should up your life insurance. Better go to a real driving school first (not one of those 'experience' things, an actual school), you'll be very happy that you did.

I do not.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#87

Post by pwaai »

myrandomcomment wrote: post #25
pwaai wrote: post #17

5:19 almost seems impossible. I think we will see sub 5 minutes within the next 5 years at this rate. It seems like Lamborghini just gave up in a dick measuring contest. Nurburgring is Porsche's home turf. German's aren't outwardly nationalistic but they take a lot of pride and result orientated bunch. Also ironic that Lambo is practically an Audi. I will buy a porsche instead of a Lambo, this type of effort just sho…

Start here. http://www.dreamracing.com/ Once you can handle the Porsche 911 GT Race Car then maybe..

Danke!

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#88

Post by RaceWon »

kirse wrote: post #14

Comically fast, like video-game-I-can-just-hit-restart fast. A couple highlights of that YouTube video from sections of the track that are notoriously difficult: [YouTube Time] 00:49 -> 00:53 - Flugplatz at nearly 170mph is insane. Total trust in downforce and makes up many seconds if done right. 01:13 -> 01:25 - Fuchsrohre bottoming out at 200+ mph is nuts. 03:15 -> 03:20 - Interesting that Timo avoids the carousel.…

> A sub-5 Ring time would easily be possible with a non-homologated F1 car similar to this unrestricted 919.

Easily? No, I respectfully disagree with your assessment of what is involved. CFD is not even close to being able to accurately predict a race car's handling so therefore it would take testing--a lot of it. In all likelihood it would cost hundreds of millions of dollars to design, test and build a GP car that could beat that time. It would require wind tunnel time, new CFD models, new motors and on and on.

So yes, while I agree it is possible with a genius like Vettel or Hamilton, or IMO that would be a perfect mission for Max (who I think is of the caliber of Senna, and as Senna disciple, I don't say that lightly) at the wheel; it could probably happen. Of course, we would also need a designer of the caliber of an Adrian Newey, because no single modern F1 track even approaches The Ring. It would be a massive undertaking.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#89

Post by RaceWon »

forapurpose wrote: post #20
kirse wrote: post #14

Comically fast, like video-game-I-can-just-hit-restart fast. A couple highlights of that YouTube video from sections of the track that are notoriously difficult: [YouTube Time] 00:49 -> 00:53 - Flugplatz at nearly 170mph is insane. Total trust in downforce and makes up many seconds if done right. 01:13 -> 01:25 - Fuchsrohre bottoming out at 200+ mph is nuts. 03:15 -> 03:20 - Interesting that Timo avoids the carousel.…

Knowing nothing about this subject, I'm a bit confused by the parent: The first section talks about how incredible the performance is - "comically fast", "nuts", etc. The second to last paragraph seems to say that it is easily done. Would you explain to easily confused, non-car-racing-enthusiasts? EDIT: In fact, I should ask: What is the significance of Nurburgring?

To drive a race car really, really fast requires rhythm. You have to be able tell when something is amiss Before it actually is, because then it is too late. Having rhythm is essential, so you need an database of events on that particular track, in that particular car in order to develop your rhythm. You need to have the track absolutely memorized to the extent that you can visualize every single inch of it as you are "driving" it in your imagination so that you can "bench race" it.

It also requires anticipation; you have to know Exactly what the car is going to, in every situation, and that gives you the ability to make corrections Before the fact, because again; during is too late. Now couple these things with the sheer length, number of corners and top speed of the Nurburgring and you have an idea of what a lap like that takes.

Re: Porsche shatters the Nürburgring record we thought was unbreakable

#90

Post by RaceWon »

bertjk wrote: post #35

I would love to see how fast this can be done by a customized self driving car. (think: full knowledge of track geometries, of its own physical specifications, etc..)

She's not even a racing driver much less a world class racer (and like all sports there is a HUGE difference between a participant and one of the Worlds' best. The same holds true for top-shelf racers; they are Not paid millions a year because they are brave, they are paid because of their skill) and she beat this car.

"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8C4FJilePPU"

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