Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

techcrunch.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 148 posts

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#101

Post by codeulike »

meddlepal wrote: post #94
windexh8er wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the major players operate under a debt and profit cycle. It's just that nobody else is also building a new car company and one that is a paradigm shift. https://simplywall.st/stocks/us/automobiles/nyse-gm/general-... On top of the fact they were bailed out.

Calling Tesla a paradigm shift is laughable. It's an electric car company and they put a fancy touch screen HUD in the dashboard. Revolutionary!

You need to look at how their battery packs work. An EV battery pack is not just a big battery, its a massive system all of its own, with monitoring, cooling, etc. Tesla's battery packs are way ahead of anyone else's, and also produced at a lower price per kwh.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#102

Post by HeadsUpHigh »

sschueller wrote: post #14
Faaak wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious as to why you would be reluctant to buy a car assembled "in the open" ? Would you be afraid to drive it outside too ?

Because certain parts should not be exposed to the outside until assembled or they need to be cleaned again. You want clean welding joints and seems where you glue things together. Certain glues or compounds don't work well in certain temperatures/humidities, you want a controlled environment.

They are only doing parts of the assembly there. Processes that require a cleanroom e.g. paintjobs are done inside the factory.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#103

Post by compton_effect »

KallDrexx wrote: post #93
brightball wrote: post #92

In the electric space it seems like it's going to be Tesla and GM for the foreseeable future. None of Tesla's other competitors are putting out anything remotely close to the Volt and Bolt.

What about Nissan? The Leaf seems to be doing well even though it gets ignored in these conversations.

The issue with the leaf is the battery is not thermally managed at all. So you get a lot of battery degradation over years. After 5 years of ownership you can see a huge decrease in capacity compared to a climate controlled battery.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#104

Post by jacquesm »

std_throwaway wrote: post #55

Will my money be safe if they go bankrupt between payment and delivery?

No, in that case you'll be lining up with the rest of the creditors and I'd assume you will get back nothing at all or pennies on the dollar at best.

You're playing bank. Hot tip: don't buy cars that are not in front of you and that you can walk around, only buy cars from manufacturers with long term stability to ensure that the vehicle you've bought will function during its economic life in your hands.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#105

Post by _ph_ »

catherinezng wrote: post #65
jillesvangurp wrote: post #56

The way I see it, logistics aside, Tesla has awesome cars that are loved by those that manage to get one delivered, customers are actually lining up to buy them to the extent of paying just to get in line for that years ahead of time, and they are pretty much guaranteed to sell anything they ship for the foreseeable future. Better still most of their would be competitors are either not shipping at all right now, year…

Tesla lost ~$2B last year, owes ~$10B in debt, and owes >$400M in interest payments per year alone. Moody’s downgraded Tesla’s bond rating because Tesla will need to raise more money this year, at least $2B (which is an extremely conservative figure), to avoid Chapter 11 bankruptcy. Elon Musk also owes >$600M in personal debt that he financed using Tesla stock as collateral. This means that if Tesla stock dips below…

And that is the reason why Elon reduced the speed for aggressive growth for the next few months and is pushing for actual profits in Q3 and Q4. With 5000 Model 3/Week (and 2+k S/S), Tesla has plenty of cash flow, they just need to stop spending money on future projects faster than they earn it.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#106

Post by basch »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #56

The way I see it, logistics aside, Tesla has awesome cars that are loved by those that manage to get one delivered, customers are actually lining up to buy them to the extent of paying just to get in line for that years ahead of time, and they are pretty much guaranteed to sell anything they ship for the foreseeable future. Better still most of their would be competitors are either not shipping at all right now, year…

Its pretty clear Chevy, Niassan, Hyundai/Kia, and Toyota are already competitive in many regards.

Jaguar, Audi, and BMW arent three years behind.

Right now its about perceived luxary and marketing, and a bit of a software / business model lead.

I dont think any of those companies would be three years behind if they actually tried to deliver a market leading luxury car, although some might need to acquihire some better software divisions.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#107

Post by _ph_ »

misja111 wrote: post #97
davedx wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not right now: "One car alone doesn’t crowd the field. But Geneva was a showcase for a rush of coming EVs and hybrids." The i-Pace is almost out. The others... aren't. I'm particularly skeptical of Audi's gigantic marketing machine.

The Geneva expo was on March 1st, by now the i-Pace has arrived in the showrooms. The E-Tron Quattro is said to go in production in the upcoming months and to be deliverable by the end of the year.

The i-Pace is great and the first real competitor to Tesla, but they are making about 20k/year, so it is a welcome addition to the electric car offerings, but won't cut into Tesla sales. Actually the electric car market is going to grow in the next years faster than the worldwide production capacity for electric cars, so there won't be huge problems selling all the made cars.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#108

Post by HeadsUpHigh »

nabla9 wrote: post #42
Brotkrumen wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't want to make that assumption without further information. If you are right, a lot of highly trained and paid people have made a grave mistake in their throughput estimates and might still be lying about it. On the other hand there could be bottlenecks they know how to solve but are waiting for the tooling to be done.

Within last 1.5 years highly trained and paid people have made something like 5-7 large mistakes in their Model 3 throughput estimates in a row already. Few more is not that surprising. They are constantly facing bottlenecks that take them by surprise while they are learning to mass manufacture. Tesla is small volume luxury car maker that attempts to transfer into mass manufacturer with NIH attitude.

Tesla has had an insane learning curve to climb. Making a car... just think of how many different subsystems exist. A lot of them could be offloaded to contractors but they chose to do as much in house as possible( which also aligns with Musk's character).

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#109

Post by _ph_ »

compcoffee wrote: post #43
Faaak wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure that the guys there are not that stupid. You can weld "in the open". Just have to make sure that there are not big air flows

> are not that stupid Then why are they producing cars in a tent in then first place? NUMMI was building 6000 cars a week at its peak,and Teslas are supposed to be simpler and the manufacturing process more advanced.

I don't know what their precise constraints are, but they are already building 2500 S/X per week there, add the 5000 Model 3 and you are already at 7500 cars per week. Tesla also produces more parts in house than other car manufacturers, that might contribute to the space constraints.

Re: Tesla opens the Model 3 reservation floodgates

#110

Post by _ph_ »

jacquesm wrote: post #104
std_throwaway wrote: post #55

Will my money be safe if they go bankrupt between payment and delivery?

No, in that case you'll be lining up with the rest of the creditors and I'd assume you will get back nothing at all or pennies on the dollar at best. You're playing bank. Hot tip: don't buy cars that are not in front of you and that you can walk around, only buy cars from manufacturers with long term stability to ensure that the vehicle you've bought will function during its economic life in your hands.

Technically speaking, aren't Tesla and Ford the only two American car companies, who haven't ever gone bankrupt? :)
Post reply on HN