Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

quantamagazine.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 125 posts

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#21

Post by bookofjoe »

aphextron wrote: post #19
bookofjoe wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The idea of neatly editing specific genes to produce a desired result always sat with me as the pinnacle of human hubris. See, for example: Gene Therapy in a Patient with Sickle Cell Disease https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1609677

I literally can't understand a single word on that page. Care to explain?

"We describe our first patient treated with lentiviral vector–mediated addition of an antisickling β-globin gene into autologous hematopoietic stem cells."

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#23

Post by bookofjoe »

aphextron wrote: post #13
api wrote: post #4

Having studied biology and genetics this is common sense to me. Genetic systems are probabilistic chemical systems where everything influences everything to varying degrees in parallel. They are nothing like the linear assemblies of modules that humans prefer to engineer.

>Having studied biology and genetics this is common sense to me. Genetic systems are probabilistic chemical systems where everything influences everything to varying degrees in parallel. They are nothing like the linear assemblies of modules that humans prefer to engineer. I'm really glad that this mental model I've built up seems to reflect reality. The idea of neatly editing specific genes to produce a desired resu…

From 2010: Transfusion independence and HMGA2 activation after gene therapy of human β-thalassaemia https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3355472/

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#24

Post by Analemma_ »

jcims wrote: post #22

I was hoping CRISPR/Cas9 (or some similar system) was going to answer many prayers. Maybe this means it's less likely?

I imagine CRISPR/Cas9 still has great potential for addressing specific genetic disorders (which are usually localized to a single, known gene), but the more transhumanist stuff about making smarter, longer-lived people is still a ways off.

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#25

Post by theoh »

jds375 wrote: post #17
madhadron wrote: post #10

There's a couple of things that are slowly changing in the thinking of biologists related to this: 1. Genes are not loci. The "one gene = one protein" dogma of molecular biology (expanded: "one trait selectable in breeding experiments = one compact locus of the chromosome") was a priori wrong, but it's taken us decades to undo the damage. We were led astray because there are traits that do map to a single locus, or s…

Very interesting comment, thanks! Could you elaborate on what you mean by ‘evolution doesn’t abstract’? I did not totally understand what the example given had to do with abstraction

Presumably they mean that material evolution doesn't involve ideas, which is what abstractions are.

This is a physicalist line to take which implies that the universe is entirely material, and abstraction is just something human minds perceive.

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#26

Post by ancorevard »

Two things:

1. The theory of "junk DNA" of which the authors received Nobel Price is increasingly looking like...well...junk.

2. The recent discovery of Epigenetics adds a whole other dimension for understanding traits and genetics. Lots of biological science needs to be rewritten/updated in the years to come.

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#27

Post by biot »

madhadron wrote: post #10

There's a couple of things that are slowly changing in the thinking of biologists related to this: 1. Genes are not loci. The "one gene = one protein" dogma of molecular biology (expanded: "one trait selectable in breeding experiments = one compact locus of the chromosome") was a priori wrong, but it's taken us decades to undo the damage. We were led astray because there are traits that do map to a single locus, or s…

I often think of that scene in Contact where they are trying to decrypt the alien message: https://youtu.be/HgPSUer1ujM

Multiple genetic materials operating on multiple levels...

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#28

Post by tw1010 »

jds375 wrote: post #17
madhadron wrote: post #10

There's a couple of things that are slowly changing in the thinking of biologists related to this: 1. Genes are not loci. The "one gene = one protein" dogma of molecular biology (expanded: "one trait selectable in breeding experiments = one compact locus of the chromosome") was a priori wrong, but it's taken us decades to undo the damage. We were led astray because there are traits that do map to a single locus, or s…

Very interesting comment, thanks! Could you elaborate on what you mean by ‘evolution doesn’t abstract’? I did not totally understand what the example given had to do with abstraction

Yeah, great comment. Definitely a "best of HN comments" candidate.

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#29

Post by dekhn »

aphextron wrote: post #13
api wrote: post #4

Having studied biology and genetics this is common sense to me. Genetic systems are probabilistic chemical systems where everything influences everything to varying degrees in parallel. They are nothing like the linear assemblies of modules that humans prefer to engineer.

>Having studied biology and genetics this is common sense to me. Genetic systems are probabilistic chemical systems where everything influences everything to varying degrees in parallel. They are nothing like the linear assemblies of modules that humans prefer to engineer. I'm really glad that this mental model I've built up seems to reflect reality. The idea of neatly editing specific genes to produce a desired resu…

There are diseases for which editing a single gene in the right set of cells would absolutely cure a disease. There might be other genes or regulatory elements involved, but their contribution is neglible.

To me, the pinnacle of human hubris is thinking you can correct the more challenging ones (like the ubergenetic phenotypes described here) without having some sort of powerful technology that helps work with the irreducible complexity of probabilistic chemical systems.

Re: Theory Suggests That All Genes Affect Every Complex Trait

#30

Post by danharaj »

theoh wrote: post #25
jds375 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting comment, thanks! Could you elaborate on what you mean by ‘evolution doesn’t abstract’? I did not totally understand what the example given had to do with abstraction

Presumably they mean that material evolution doesn't involve ideas, which is what abstractions are. This is a physicalist line to take which implies that the universe is entirely material, and abstraction is just something human minds perceive.

> ...abstraction is just something human minds perceive.

This itself is a physical phenomenon :)

Post reply on HN