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Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

bbc.co.uk

101–110 of 431 posts

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#101
post #52
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would argue that the 10 amendment in the Bill of Rights is all that a person would need to nullify gross overreaches of power by the federal government.

Good luck convincing the Supreme Court to upend the basis of a huge portion of federal law and decades of judicial precedence in favor of very broad readings of the enumerated powers.

Supreme Court is getting better, more liberal decisions over years.

Gay sex and gay marriage cases were great and justified expansions on the 5th amendment (substantiative due process of the law).

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#102
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if this has anything to do with the recent breakdown in US-Canada relations? Maybe the Canadians are less concerned with offending us now?

This is the result of a campaign promise made in 2015.

Yes, it's been in the works for years and a multi-billion dollar industry has grown up around recreational cannabis already. Canopy Growth was listed on the NYSE this year.

https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/WEED:CN

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#103
post #69
post #48

Should any substance which enhances the risk of schizophrenia be legalized? https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php It appears to me that if cannabis was a food additive with the same risk profile, no one would think it should be legal. I understand that the counter-argument is "What about tobacco/alcohol?" But those substances are already legal and there are no "equal opportunities" rights for drugs. Li…

I'd say yes. I think my own right put whatever substances I'd like into my own body is an inherent good that outweighs whatever other negative consequences there may be. (So I'd also like to heroin, meth, etc. legalized.) But even if you don't subscribe to that belief, it's pretty obvious that the ills of prohibition of cannabis far outweigh its very mild negative side-effects (which are far more minor than those of…

I agree with this - on the receiving side. Users of heroine, meth, etc are victims or at least mental health cases. -- They need medical help, not criminalization.

Prosecute the distribution channels all night and all day, but if we make it legal to 'use' and 'ingest' anything -- libertarian style (I'm a left-leaning technocratic democratic socialist), and only prosecute sales/distributions of banned substance, --it might make 'users' more open to coming forward and saying -- hey, I need help, this is destroying my life and I can't kick it without help.

Instead of them thinking.. I need help, but fuck it -- if anyone finds out I'll go to jail.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#104

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

The irony of Brits saying these things specifically, is that they were one of the first to formally study the social effects of cannabis, as early as 1894 - and before all the Anslinger madness. Here's what they found - note the conclusion especially:

"In regard to the physical effects, the Commission have come to the conclusion that the moderate use of hemp drugs is practically attended by no evil results at all. There may be exceptional cases in which, owing to idiosyncrasies of constitution, the drugs in even moderate use may be injurious. There is probably nothing the use of which may not possibly be injurious in cases of exceptional intolerance.

In respect to the alleged mental effects of the drugs, the Commission have come to the conclusion that the moderate use of hemp drugs produces no injurious effects on the mind. It may indeed be accepted that in the case of specially marked neurotic diathesis, even the moderate use may produce mental injury. For the slightest mental stimulation or excitement may have that effect in such cases. But putting aside these quite exceptional cases, the moderate use of these drugs produces no mental injury.

In regard to the moral effects of the drugs, the Commission are of opinion that their moderate use produces no moral injury whatever. There is no adequate ground for believing that it injuriously affects the character of the consumer.

Viewing the subject generally, it may be added that the moderate use of these drugs is the rule, and that the excessive use is comparatively exceptional. The moderate use practically produces no ill effects. In all but the most exceptional cases, the injury from habitual moderate use is not appreciable. The excessive use may certainly be accepted as very injurious, though it must be admitted that in many excessive consumers the injury is not clearly marked. The injury done by the excessive use is, however, confined almost exclusively to the consumer himself; the effect on society is rarely appreciable. It has been the most striking feature in this inquiry to find how little the effects of hemp drugs have obtruded themselves on observation. The large number of witnesses of all classes who professed never to have seen these effects, the vague statements made by many who professed to have observed them, the very few witnesses who could so recall a case as to give any definite account of it, and the manner in which a large proportion of these cases broke down on the first attempt to examine them, are facts which combine to show most clearly how little injury society has hitherto sustained from hemp drugs."

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Hemp_Drugs_Commission)

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#105
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to point fingers, but I feel like some generations were sleeping hard on the government. The Constitution is almost entirely built to give citizens the power, and to limit the role of government as much as possible. And now society has fallen into a trap of misinformation and distraction. Can future generations push out the corrupt leaders after they pass away? #termlimitsoncongress

Oh, we're screwed. I mean, thats my opinion at least. They'll continue dividing us one by one and limiting our rights and livelihoods. Take a look around-- how many of your friends have jumped multiple social classes in the past decade?

Who is this "they" you speak of? The citizens elected to govern? Or a shadowy cabal of unknown entities working in secret toward some ominous cause that ends in you being forced to do everything you don't want to do?

Honestly, follow any "we're all screwed our government sucks" logic train to its conclusion and you hit one of two conclusions: A) oh shit, it's actually my fault along with everyone else's that we're in this mess, B) conspiracy theory.

We do actually live in a representative democracy with checks and balances, and we do actually have the power to fix it if we choose to. We have a much better chance of changing things without resorting to violence than a pretty sizeable part of the planet.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#106
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck convincing the Supreme Court to upend the basis of a huge portion of federal law and decades of judicial precedence in favor of very broad readings of the enumerated powers.

How is that a broad reading? Under what reasonable interpretation of the Constitution does the federal government have the power to tell you not to grow plants on your own property for your own consumption?

Under Wickard v. Filburn: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn

You can argue that it's not a reasonable interpretation - I would agree with that. But it is a long-standing one, and there are a lot of things that the feds do today that hinge pretty much solely on it - and that includes pet issues for both the left and the right. Just to give one example, aside from enabling the feds to ban weed, Wickard also enables the feds to enforce the Civil Rights Acts. So it is very unlikely for that interpretation to go away - there's too much staked on it politically.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#107

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

Drug use is a moral failing, it sounds like you just don't like the morality. Morals are not necessarily what is convenient or fun or pleasurable.

In some interpretations, moderate use is not a moral failing, but heavy or compulsive use is.

All that applies to alcohol as well, so I agree if we're going say that alcohol is legal, then other drugs used in similar ways should be legal as well.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#108

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs

It's not obvious to me. The fundamental question is, does an individual own their own body? If the answer is yes, then don't try to restrict what I can do with it so long as I don't harm anyone else. If the answer is no, well, then we need to firm up exactly what the arrangement is supposed to be.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Possible steps in that direction https://reason.com/blog/2018/06/08/trump-endorses-marijuana-...

You're being downvoted because it's Trump, which is bullshit. It's the first time in modern US history that a sitting President has come anywhere close to declaring support for or proclaiming he'd be ok with the Federal Government legalizing recreational marijuana consumption. The reason for that, is because Trump is an aggressive populist that doesn't particularly care about entrenched, ancient political live wires.…

The problem is that legalization of cannabis in US was never actually about cannabis per se. It was about this:

"The primary reason to outlaw marijuana is its effect on the degenerate races.​"

"Reefer makes darkies think they're as good as white men.​"

"Marihuana leads to pacifism and communist brainwashing.​"

"There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the US, and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz and swing, result from marijuana usage. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers and any others.​​"

Now, these quotes are from the pre-WW2 period, when this insanity first began. But they lingered for a lot longer than that, even if the language changed. This is from the Nixon era:

"You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin. And then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities," Ehrlichman said. "We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."

In other words, it was always a weapon in the "culture war". And that is kinda at another peak right now, so I'm not too optimistic about this happening in US until it's over.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#110
post #56
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article states that age is a factor and children and teens are at risk. Marijuana age of consent is 19

If you read any weed forum you’ll find endless posts of people who can’t smoke anymore because it causes paranoia and panic attacks. Same with me, used to be fun and now it causes anxiety. There are definitely some long term effects and changes to the brain that have not been sufficiently studied. Luckily it will be much easier now to do those studies.

I've never used, but even w/ health risks, it's better to legalize and decriminalize than send young mothers/fathers to jail and basically create cycle's of poverty.

One of the biggest demographics of poverty in America is single-mother's who's bf's are incarcerated usually for drug offenses, though of course some might be gang and other criminal offenses - but still a lot of that has drug related connotations.

If mj is regulated/sold openly then likely they won't be distributing on street corners and going to jail, or using and going to jail for possession, causing them to become even harder criminals by association and thus start life-long criminal careers, and giving up on being a good father, and provider.

My philosophy is let anyone ingest anything they want (Tide pods are still legal), if they're stupid enough to die or maim themselves -- people shoot firecrackers from their hand and doesn't always end well - people just do stupid shit, but it's their choice/freedom to do so. Until they step over the line and injure others as a result of their stupid actions, let them have that freedom and the government should step out.

The government should have help for those who need it to get into rehab/medical treatment and support those who want to get off hard drugs, but deal with it as a medical condition, not a criminal one. People should feel safe going to a hospital and saying I have a drug addiction and want to quit, please help me - without fear of going to jail.

The government can prosecute blackmarket sales though, all night/day, I'm cool w/ that, I feel the end-user's are victims even though they choose to 'buy', I don't think they should be at fault for being a 'consumer' of goods, those capitalizing on it should be the only ones charged.

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