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GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

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Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#91

Post by jordanlev »

lsalvatore wrote: post #81
jordanlev wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> React (really JSX) solves the single problem of making HTML a part of JavaScript. This is the crux of the matter. The people who find Vue appealing (myself included) come from the world of design and html+css markup and jQuery. We're not looking to get html into our JavaScript -- rather we're looking to get JavaScript into our html! There is absolutely no reason to switch from React to Vue if it's working for you (…

Appreciate your comment, it sounds like Vue may be an easier option for you, if you don't want to write JavaScript. However, you should just learn JavaScript, even if you're doing nothing but designing components, will explain why. I also came from jQuery (Backbone and jQuery was a popular duo, in fact using jQuery in everything was). The way people wrote apps at one point basically was a stream of jQuery statements,…

lol, I've been a javascript developer (among other things) for over 15 years :)

The point is that some people/teams/environments prefer to not treat everything as a javascript app. Especially in the agency world -- thinking about one's website from a markup/design-first perspective is a totally viable thing. And if you have designers on your team (or for solo practitioners) you sometimes don't want to javascript all the things. It's great that you found an approach that works for you, but it doesn't mean that it's the only best way for everyone and every situation.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#92

Post by lsalvatore »

yayana wrote: post #79
lsalvatore wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only bizarre thing is the HTML was ever separate from JavaScript in the first place.

How is that bizarre? Trying to enforce MVC is done even when it is a lost cause.. But you properly separate html, css and (arbitrary Code language to be replaced by transpiling) and all you hear is "I wish my graphic artist had to understand all of this and what a compiler does before he could fix my poor UX ideas.. and my copywriter should have to find my spelling mistakes using an IDE too." If my graphic artist exp…

It sounds like you're coming from a landing page/blog/Wordpress background. I'm primarily building data-driven apps, like financial data or dashboards. My UX/UI people don't come near my code, and I wouldn't want them to.

For me, every time I need a new button, I'm not going to my designer, I'm just copying over the last button. So I need to be able to quickly edit styles, and state functionality, like dropdowns and date pickers. For these types of components, your life will be a living hell if every time you needed to add a style, you were going to a CSS/HTML file. This was how we first worked with Backbone and Handlebars, and it absolutely sucked.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#93

Post by tomc1985 »

lsalvatore wrote: post #66
lsalvatore wrote: post #45

No one I work with has ever even brought up the possibility of switching from React to Vue, let alone counting Github stars. Compare to when React came out, it was immediate consensus that we need to switch from Backbone to React. When Angular gained popularity, we did not have an urge to switch because it felt unclear what the scope and direction of Angular actually was. React (really JSX) solves the single problem…

I also wanted to make an additional comment expressing my frustration with the consistently negative comments on posts like this about JS Frameworks. These commenters, those who see React as "just another JS Framework" and whom see JavaScript developers as people who would change JS Frameworks as if they were ordering a new drink at Starbucks: These people are the epitome of amateur. Building web apps has been my car…

It's grand pronouncements like that that epitomize amateurishness. I am so sick of seeing people complain about how things are being X years ago, as if old techniques somehow magically become invalid. Maybe they seem so bad because the practitioner sucked at that time.

React doesn't really respect separation of concerns, and it's rare to find an SPA (and now, desktop apps -- thanks Electron!) that isn't complete garbage. Disciplined approach with battle-tested techniques creates much higher-quality software, every time.

Also, "paradigm shift" is nonsense. The web is a platform -- fetishizing specific tools and techniques is foolish. There are many ways to skin a cat.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#94

Post by amelius »

jaequery wrote: post #70
amelius wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> With React there's no weird "v-if ng-if" template logic that you have to grapple with. Yes, I hate that syntax. It's like they picked the worst from HTML and Javascript. Instead "if" statements should be dealt with in Javascript entirely. It's one of the reasons why I don't use Vue.

that was how i felt too which was the same reason i disliked angular. but vue's templating syntax have turned out to be really enjoyable to use. it made me think how wrong i was of my initial impression of vue. you have to give it a try to understand it.

Sorry, I appreciate your enthusiasm, but I just can't imagine how shoehorning a language into XML could ever be a good idea.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#95

Post by hesarenu »

DanHulton wrote: post #54
aldoushuxley001 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't Vue the new jQuery? Because you can drop it in so much easier

In usage, maybe. React is the "people are learning this instead of raw javascript" kind of default that jQuery became. I hope it does the same thing that jQuery did, and that is essentially make itself unnecessary in a lot of ways. Take all the really good features of React and make them browser-native. To a certain degree, this is already happening. Web components are inching closer every day.

React apps would require more raw JavaScript then say Vue/angular with their own template logic stuff.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#96

Post by lsalvatore »

smdz wrote: post #68
lsalvatore wrote: post #45

No one I work with has ever even brought up the possibility of switching from React to Vue, let alone counting Github stars. Compare to when React came out, it was immediate consensus that we need to switch from Backbone to React. When Angular gained popularity, we did not have an urge to switch because it felt unclear what the scope and direction of Angular actually was. React (really JSX) solves the single problem…

>When Angular gained popularity, we did not have an urge to switch because it felt unclear what the scope and direction of Angular actually was. I do not remember React coming in before Angular. I loved Angular1. But Angular2 made me very uncomfortable and thats when I switched to React. And I'm not looking back. Even if I need a very simple drop-in not-transpiled solution without the React tooling - I always fall ba…

Sorry, I told the story out of order, we saw Angular and passed on it.

Also have no regrets or issues with React. Been 3 years now and I have no complaints or frustrations with my job anymore, compared to the horror of adding jQuery plugins.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#97

Post by Canadauni »

max_im wrote: post #83
lsalvatore wrote: post #45

No one I work with has ever even brought up the possibility of switching from React to Vue, let alone counting Github stars. Compare to when React came out, it was immediate consensus that we need to switch from Backbone to React. When Angular gained popularity, we did not have an urge to switch because it felt unclear what the scope and direction of Angular actually was. React (really JSX) solves the single problem…

As someone who has built with both professionally, I'd say you're spot on. Vue has been great to work with because its readability and low-barrier to get started, but nothing beats writing plain-old JavaScript with some JSX. Not to mention, Vue can get really hairy with something as simple as passing props between components while React makes that a breeze.

Just to note you can use render functions and write jsx in Vue :) https://vuejs.org/v2/guide/render-function.html

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#98

Post by baddox »

crooked-v wrote: post #52
lsalvatore wrote: post #45

No one I work with has ever even brought up the possibility of switching from React to Vue, let alone counting Github stars. Compare to when React came out, it was immediate consensus that we need to switch from Backbone to React. When Angular gained popularity, we did not have an urge to switch because it felt unclear what the scope and direction of Angular actually was. React (really JSX) solves the single problem…

To me, React also has the killer feature of being "generic enough" that I can see directly migrate-able variants of it still being used in ten years. The backend may change, but the basic setup of JSX -> function transpiling with param-attribute equivalency is simple enough to be a new foundational structure.

That's a big one for me, particularly with the way I prefer to write all my React components: as stateless functional components (just a function that takes props as its only argument and returns some JSX). For adding state, lifecycle methods, etc. I'm using recompose, which is also generic enough that I could easily see myself reimplementing it for some future view library.

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#99

Post by lsalvatore »

tomc1985 wrote: post #93
lsalvatore wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also wanted to make an additional comment expressing my frustration with the consistently negative comments on posts like this about JS Frameworks. These commenters, those who see React as "just another JS Framework" and whom see JavaScript developers as people who would change JS Frameworks as if they were ordering a new drink at Starbucks: These people are the epitome of amateur. Building web apps has been my car…

It's grand pronouncements like that that epitomize amateurishness. I am so sick of seeing people complain about how things are being X years ago, as if old techniques somehow magically become invalid. Maybe they seem so bad because the practitioner sucked at that time. React doesn't really respect separation of concerns, and it's rare to find an SPA (and now, desktop apps -- thanks Electron!) that isn't complete garb…

You're right! I'm sure there's plenty of high-grade apps still out there that are built on jQuery plugin spaghetti code. No problem with that at all. No reason to criticize that either in any way shape or form. jQuery spaghetti is still a perfectly delicious way to enjoy a web app. Who doesn't love spaghetti?

Re: GitHub Stars !== Usage: React Is Still Blowing Vue and Angular Away

#100

Post by tomc1985 »

lsalvatore wrote: post #99
tomc1985 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's grand pronouncements like that that epitomize amateurishness. I am so sick of seeing people complain about how things are being X years ago, as if old techniques somehow magically become invalid. Maybe they seem so bad because the practitioner sucked at that time. React doesn't really respect separation of concerns, and it's rare to find an SPA (and now, desktop apps -- thanks Electron!) that isn't complete garb…

You're right! I'm sure there's plenty of high-grade apps still out there that are built on jQuery plugin spaghetti code. No problem with that at all. No reason to criticize that either in any way shape or form. jQuery spaghetti is still a perfectly delicious way to enjoy a web app. Who doesn't love spaghetti?

Dude if your jQuery is spaghetti that's on you
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