Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

cnbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 627 posts

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#231

Post by Fricken »

durkie wrote: post #97
Fricken wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few mistakes along the way? He's fucking delusional, and mostly works hard taking credit for the work of other people, and for other people's money (you don't get to be a billionaire any other way). He peddles a greenwashed variant of your run of the mill rocket age fantasy that engineering types get all teary eyed about. And hey, If you like accusing people of obeying Godwin's law, now's your big chance, because I…

I think you should reconsider your thoughts about this a bit. There is a genuine revolution underway being enabled by plummeting costs of producing lithium-ion batteries at scale. Whether or not Tesla will lead it (or even continue be part of it) is certainly up for debate, but large, real things are happening and saying "everyone ride a bike!" is ignoring a reality that isn't tainted by feelings about Tesla/Elon.

There isn't a revolution underway. Everyone switching to an electric personal automoblie won't save us from anything. We'll just be destroying the planet at a marginally slower rate. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#232

Post by Johnny555 »

venning wrote: post #115
anonu wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't suggest this to be paranoia. It's simply reality. Wall Street profits from the stock cratering right now. Its not unfathomable that some hedge fund would go to extreme lengths to embed a mole into the Tesla team to cause sabotage. There's a (mediocre) documentary on Netflix about Bill Ackman's famous Herbalife short. In there they detail the hundreds of $1000 spent just defending his short position through…

> the hundreds of $1000 spent just defending his short position through hiring former Herbalife people, funding legal campaigns, funding support groups You are describing entirely legal actions. Sabotage and (this form of) industrial espionage are very much illegal. There's quite a difference there. > a few $100k is pocket change for these guys But a few billion dollars of market cap and a few years of jail time are…

But a few billion dollars of market cap and a few years of jail time are the price of being found guilty of what Musk is insinuating.

If I stood to lose $100M, I wouldn't do the dirty work myself, I'd hire someone else to do it for whom taking that risk for $100K (or whatever) is worth the risk - that could be several years (tax-free) pay for some people.

I'd use several levels of anonymization or maybe redirection to try to keep my identity hidden (and I doubt I'd be successful, but it takes a certain level of arrogance to hire someone to sabotage a company because you bet against it and might be losing)

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#234

Post by durkie »

legolas2412 wrote: post #197
durkie wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you should reconsider your thoughts about this a bit. There is a genuine revolution underway being enabled by plummeting costs of producing lithium-ion batteries at scale. Whether or not Tesla will lead it (or even continue be part of it) is certainly up for debate, but large, real things are happening and saying "everyone ride a bike!" is ignoring a reality that isn't tainted by feelings about Tesla/Elon.

> There is a genuine revolution underway being enabled by plummeting costs of producing lithium-ion batteries at scale. I guess that is another story he sells. Why are Samsung and LG also able to make cheap batteries, even though they don't have a gigafactory? Too much hype. Tesla doesn't even make battery cells, they buy them off panasonic.

One of the nuances that gets lost when talking about battery costs is the difference between cell-level (individual 18650 / 2170 li-ion cells) costs and pack-level (the assembled collection of thousands of those cells) costs.

Both costs are expressed as $/kilowatt-hour but comparing them is comparing apples to apple pie.

Samsung, LG and Panasonic specialize in producing individual cells and don't do a lot of EV pack-level assembly. I think LG does pack assembly for the Chevy Bolt, but that car isn't produced in very large quantities and has a stated cell cost of $145/kwh.

There are hints that Tesla can producing entire packs at a comparable cost/kwh, if not less.

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#235

Post by gamblor956 »

Diederich wrote: post #194
avs733 wrote: post #188

I'm sorry but Musk's email is ridiculous and unprofessional, and the defenses here are extremely concerning. By ArsTechnica's count this is the 5th fire in the plant. 5th. That's insane. Report after report is that things continue to not go well and the email sent out reeks of paranoia and combined with other comments made recently are quite clearly dishonest. They aren't failing at the details of ramping a manufactu…

> Tesla's greatest enemy at this point is the cult of Elon Musk, and the cult's leader, Elon Musk. Huh, well, given that, I strongly suggest you short TSLA, which would be a sure thing, right?

Why would it be a sure thing? A short isn't just a position that the company will underperform--it's a position that the company will underperform during the time period the trader can maintain the short.

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#236

Post by [deleted] »

flyingswift wrote: post #58
tlb wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a vanilla git configuration, it's as easy as: $ vi centrifuge_rpm_controller.cc $ git commit --author "Bob Goodguy " -a -m "Totally harmless changes" $ git push In a high-stakes environment, it's probably worth signing commits. https://git-scm.com/book/en/v2/Git-Tools-Signing-Your-Work

Are we really saying that Tesla, a company building highly sensitive software, is not employing basic branch policies? How is it that these changes could have made it through a code review process and deployed to 'production'? What I take away from this is that one malicious actor was able to single handedly deploy malicious code and that there were no processes in place to stop this. That is a far more worrying issu…

[deleted]

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#237

Post by forapurpose »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #160
colechristensen wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't strike me as paranoia. Thinking that industrial espionage doesn't happen seems naive. What they have is an admitted saboteur and code that exports data to third parties. It quacks like a duck. A disgruntled employee succumbed to or sought out people who wished to do harm to Tesla. There's plenty of evidence of similar things happening. (edit to fix words) If you work in the defense industry you get things…

Great comment, but I’m not sure what events you’re referring to when you say: > American companies have overthrown governments to benefit their business Care to elaborate?

Much of U.S. Mideast activity is aimed at securing the oil supply. There is another, very serious reason for those actions (I'm not saying it justifies them): Securing the world's energy supply, without which the world economy would stumble and fall. But the activities also benefit U.S. oil companies, and who can say what is necessary for which purpose. Also note that a former oil company CEO was U.S. Secretary of State until recently.

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#238

Post by durkie »

Fricken wrote: post #231
durkie wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you should reconsider your thoughts about this a bit. There is a genuine revolution underway being enabled by plummeting costs of producing lithium-ion batteries at scale. Whether or not Tesla will lead it (or even continue be part of it) is certainly up for debate, but large, real things are happening and saying "everyone ride a bike!" is ignoring a reality that isn't tainted by feelings about Tesla/Elon.

There isn't a revolution underway. Everyone switching to an electric personal automoblie won't save us from anything. We'll just be destroying the planet at a marginally slower rate. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.

> You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.

Why not?

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#239

Post by rmetzler »

achow wrote: post #171
TimTheTinker wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great comment, but I’m not sure what events you’re referring to when you say: > American companies have overthrown governments to benefit their business Care to elaborate?

I didn't know it was this many https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_r...

Philip Agee wrote about what the CIAs modus operandi was in "Inside the Company: CIA Diary" and his later books.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Agee

Re: Elon Musk emails employees about 'extensive and damaging sabotage' by employee

#240

Post by gonvaled »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #160
colechristensen wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't strike me as paranoia. Thinking that industrial espionage doesn't happen seems naive. What they have is an admitted saboteur and code that exports data to third parties. It quacks like a duck. A disgruntled employee succumbed to or sought out people who wished to do harm to Tesla. There's plenty of evidence of similar things happening. (edit to fix words) If you work in the defense industry you get things…

Great comment, but I’m not sure what events you’re referring to when you say: > American companies have overthrown governments to benefit their business Care to elaborate?

Not only american companies: the american government does it in a regular basis. Here is one example: https://www.facts-are-facts.com/news/iranian-oil-bourse

It is not paranoia if they are really after you.

Post reply on HN