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White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

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Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#381

Post by omegaworks »

abiox wrote: post #244
omegaworks wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So... your okay with Chinese kids with heart defects, kidney and liver cancer. Show me where I said that. Of course not. You seem to be ok with every country that hopes to participate in the technological economy having their own contaminated region. Step back for a second. Think of the earth like a single-unit closed system. Would we rather have 195 regions contaminated with TCE or one/two? Your petty nationalism w…

> Show me where I said that. it seems like a logical implication, unless you're also entertaining the idea of production ending altogether. > Would we rather have 195 regions contaminated with TCE or one/two? i'm not sure, would 195 be better, or have some advantages? will all of these 'regions' be identical? > Your petty nationalism would force those kids to stay in their country AND have them deal with the toxic wa…

You’re shielding industrial chip manufacturers by using Chinese kids.

Petty nationalism will ruin this world. If every country needs its own silicon manufacturing facilities to participate in the tech economy either you’re advocating cutting most people off from the wealth it generates or your advocating for the propagation of toxic manufacturing to every state.

Both positions hurt kids. Hope you can sleep at night.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#382

Post by omegaworks »

sheepmullet wrote: post #252
omegaworks wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you really cared about Chinese people you'd let them in when they asked to immigrate here. That's enough conflating the protection of toxic industry with humanitarian concern. Stop pretending. Learn your history. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Exclusion_Act

> If you really cared about Chinese people you'd let them in when they asked to immigrate here. No I wouldn't. That makes no sense at all. You are the person who brought up kids dying. Either you care 10x more about American kids than Chinese kids or your original argument is garbage. I don't mind if you do care 10x more about American kids - it's a byproduct of our nationalist culture.

Actually OP brought up leaving kids a better world then he inherited.

The unnecessary, protectionist subsidization and expansion of toxic waste generating industries leaves ALL kids worse off.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#383

Post by omegaworks »

abiox wrote: post #253
omegaworks wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you really cared about Chinese people you'd let them in when they asked to immigrate here. That's enough conflating the protection of toxic industry with humanitarian concern. Stop pretending. Learn your history. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Exclusion_Act

> If you really cared about Chinese people you'd let them in when they asked to immigrate here. this seems to have an a lot packed in. it's not clear how advocating the departure of a minuscule amount of people from china is "helping chinese people" or otherwise demonstrating "care for chinese people". > Stop pretending. Learn your history. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Exclusion_Act this seems to be gettin…

It was the first of any American immigration laws to mention any nationality by name. The laws that replaced it subject countries like China to quotas that continue to unfairly restrict migration.

These restrictive laws have roots in the same petty nationalism that fuels protectionist subsudies.

These laws prevent kids - the kids that you claim to care about - from having a better future elsewhere.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#384

Post by candiodari »

MrMorden wrote: post #348
kinsomo wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You should only be buying from an American supplier, even though we just spent 30 years shutting them all down > Factories won’t be growing up out of the grown churning out parts in 6 mos because of this If you wanted to reverse the trend of all the American suppliers getting shut down, and re-build the American manufacturing base, what actions would you take to accomplish that?

Eliminate tariffs (and non-tariff barriers) and convince manufacturers they'll stay gone. Separate health-care payments from employment. Ensure that there's an adequate supply of vocational training. Add two zeroes to housing starts everywhere the median house price exceeds three times the median income. Nothing that isn't patently obvious, in other words.

What about the (many) tariffs and unfair laws on China's side ?

Vocational training requires industry to already exist. That's a chicken and egg issue.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#385

Post by conanbatt »

crunchlibrarian wrote: post #367
conanbatt wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How much of the tech industry goes poof if they decide to stop exporting to the US entirely? Seems like a precarious position. How much of china's goes puff.

Yes they are more dependent on us than we are them, but this is irrelevant and does not actually address the question at all.

It is very relevant: the fear that china would immolate to cause us harm is deterred by the same reason all the people that surround you don't pick up a knife and stab you to death. Its not in their interest.

Trade wars are reasonable tools of diplomatic negotiations, and china does break some rules that harm the interests of the U.S.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#386

Post by cakeface »

zach43 wrote: post #82
anon23423532 wrote: post #48

It's punishment for stealing hundreds of billions of dollars of IP, illegally subsidizing businesses to steal market share, and general national security by not outsourcing knowledge and infrastructure critical to national security to save a few bucks. It's easy to let someone push you back inch by inch instead of fighting back, but eventually you're on the edge of a cliff and have nowhere else to go. I'd take short…

> punishment for stealing hundreds of billions of dollars of IP I feel like its more the other way round...the American IP system is overly expensive and outdated, and should be reformed instead. The repercussions of this are felt most heavily on domestic industries too.

Right! If we adopted a chinese approach instead of trying to force ours on them we might actually improve intellectual property laws.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#387

Post by abiox »

omegaworks wrote: post #381
abiox wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Show me where I said that. it seems like a logical implication, unless you're also entertaining the idea of production ending altogether. > Would we rather have 195 regions contaminated with TCE or one/two? i'm not sure, would 195 be better, or have some advantages? will all of these 'regions' be identical? > Your petty nationalism would force those kids to stay in their country AND have them deal with the toxic wa…

You’re shielding industrial chip manufacturers by using Chinese kids. Petty nationalism will ruin this world. If every country needs its own silicon manufacturing facilities to participate in the tech economy either you’re advocating cutting most people off from the wealth it generates or your advocating for the propagation of toxic manufacturing to every state. Both positions hurt kids. Hope you can sleep at night.

it seems to be that there's far too much packed into your statements for me to see a "think of the children" expression as anything but a baseless or perhaps even unethical rhetorical appeal to emotion.

from what i can discern of your position, i would estimate that your views are harmful. i can sleep fine not agreeing with you.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#388

Post by Diederich »

defertoreptar wrote: post #206
Diederich wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you expand on that?

> The United States today released a list of products imported from China to the US on which additional tariffs will be placed as a measure aimed at pressuring China to change its practices the US says force US companies to give up intellectual property and transfer technology. Some industries have been dropped form the list such as pharmaceuticals, while a new list has now been announced, officials told reporters th…

Thank you.

Re: White House announces 25 percent tariff on Chinese tech goods

#390

Post by Buetol »

aoeusnth1 wrote: post #379
Buetol wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This wikipedia article is a lot more biased than the french version. Here, it’s clearly anti-protectionism by defending the age-old myth of "comparative advantage".

Wait, I didn't realize the basic principal of comparative advantage was in doubt. I'm a bit confused by your worldview - do you think that every person should produce exactly what only they need and never trade with others? What is the purpose of trade between individuals or groups?

Except if the others countries are flooding yours with cheap goods to destroy your industry and economy.

Like I've said, the french version put at least some criticism on this neoclassical point-of-view of the perfect market: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avantage_comparatif#Objections...

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