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AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

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Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#261

Post by craftyguy »

vel0city wrote: post #215
seanp2k2 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As of 2016 this is a diagram showing what went where and how it's back together now: https://www.theverge.com/2016/10/24/13389592/att-time-warner...

>f you thought music streaming exclusives were bad, just wait until Comcast starts windowing SNL sketches to keep people on its pipes while AT&T only streams CNN to AT&T phones, while Verizon keeps wielding mobile access to NFL games like a club against the American consumer. Such an anti-consumer dystopia :( It is truly sad to see these markets devolve into such terribleness when there is so much possibility to be h…

Wow, with this deal it's even more consolidated than before the breakup.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#262

Post by rayiner »

unclebucknasty wrote: post #254
rayiner wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

E.g. http://stopthecap.com/2011/06/29/san-francisco-still-in-stal...

Your example is a 2011 instance of a citizen's group in a single CA city opposing AT&T's indiscriminate installation of unsightly 4-6 foot boxes on sidewalks and other public property? The group asked that they instead be installed on private property or underground. And it's an issue that was also raised in other non-California cities, including places like NC, CT, IL, DC, etc. See your article, links from it, and […

The SF battle was particularly protracted and terrible. But the point about "unsightly" boxes gets to the heart of the problem. Burying this infrastructure costs money, and tanks the economics of fiber deployment. If you don't believe that coming from "big evil AT&T," just look at Google: they categorically refused to build Fiber to cities that imposed those sorts of requirements: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/09/how-kansas-city-....

Places like Louisville and Kansas City got Fiber and San Francisco or LA didn't because: 1) they didn't impose build out requirements (the obligation to pass all households regardless of neighborhood demand); 2) they didn't require burying utilities; 3) they fast-tracked permitting processes; 4) they permitted hanging rather than burying the fiber; and 5) they made space available for Fiber huts.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#263

Post by craftyguy »

Rick-Butler wrote: post #166
craftyguy wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ma Bell 2.0

not exactly the best example when you consider what their research arm bell labs gave us. Not saying that monopolies are good, it's just not black and white...

Even a steaming pile of shit has one or two good qualities.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#264

Post by takeda »

paulddraper wrote: post #111
ribosometronome wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the DOJ's motives were completely tainted by Trump's hostility toward CNN.

Obviously, whatever Trump does is bad, whether busting monopolies or not busting monopolies.

That was a good thing, but for wrong reasons.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#266

Post by Rick-Butler »

craftyguy wrote: post #263
Rick-Butler wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not exactly the best example when you consider what their research arm bell labs gave us. Not saying that monopolies are good, it's just not black and white...

Even a steaming pile of shit has one or two good qualities.

A comment like this makes me think you really don't know much about Bell Labs.

http://blog.tmcnet.com/next-generation-communications/2011/0...

A lot of modern computing traces back to them and Xerox.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#267

Post by jaredklewis »

skywhopper wrote: post #235
jaredklewis wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's catastrophic. Companies should be allowed to either own the pipe or what flows through the pipe. Any attempts to own both need to be stopped and punished. Not producing content doesn't magically make an ISP a neutral provider and I don't see how vertical integration (owning the pipe and some of what's going through it) gives ISPs more leverage than they already have. For example, take an ISP that is just the p…

Not having a direct interest doesn’t guarantee they are neutral, true. That’s what net neutrality rules are for. But giving them interest in the content guarantees they _arent_ neutral, and will always have conflicting interests, regardless of regulation.

If there was regulation, it doesn’t matter if they have a conflict of interest, because it would be illegal to prefer their own traffic.

If there is no regulation, AT&T has the exact same incentive to abuse their market position to make more money whether or not they own Time Warner. Whether they own Time Warner or not, they can make more money by being a non-neutral provider. Will they suddenly have a greater interest in money after they acquire Time Warner?

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#268

Post by craftyguy »

Rick-Butler wrote: post #266
craftyguy wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even a steaming pile of shit has one or two good qualities.

A comment like this makes me think you really don't know much about Bell Labs. http://blog.tmcnet.com/next-generation-communications/2011/0... A lot of modern computing traces back to them and Xerox.

I know about Bell Labs and their contributions. They were the one positive thing from Ma Bell, but there were a LOT of other bad things in Ma Bell that I'd rather not see come about again. I bet we can have a Bell Labs-like thing exist without all the other crap.

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#269

Post by njarboe »

dionidium wrote: post #253
njarboe wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of trolly transportation systems were built in the US with the same model. Build a line out to the cheep farmland you own near a city/town, charge low fairs (not nearly enough to cover your capital costs and running costs), but now you can sell lots for housing at 10x or 20x the price you bought the land for. Once all the lots are sold, having the trolly pay for itself is difficult, especially after people can b…

That's a pretty simplistic conclusion that ignores one of the biggest technological and cultural life-altering inventions in human history: the automobile.

"Once all the lots are sold, having the trolly pay for itself is difficult, especially after people can buy cars"?

Re: AT&T Cleared by Judge to Buy Time Warner

#270

Post by kristopolous »

rayiner wrote: post #260
kristopolous wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest impediment is corrupt corporate capital not investing in their infrastructure. Some have taken government subsidies and threw elaborate parties and went on luxury cruises while not building anything. There's court cases about it, such as https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151022/09232532594/fcc-h... The companies take that money and do things like buy multi-billion dollar companies with it instead. The m…

> The biggest impediment is corrupt corporate capital not investing in their infrastructure. This is easily disprovable. Broadband providers invest tens of billions a year in infrastructure. The fastest cable or wireless connection available to you is probably 10x faster than it was a decade ago. By comparison, your Intel laptop is maybe 3-4 times faster, maybe less. That cost gobs of money--building cell towers, pus…

There's a lot here. Thanks for responding. I'll hopefully have the time to read that document and get back to you later.
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