Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

181–190 of 968 posts

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#181

Post by pascalxus »

Of course, now that start ups are starting out side the bay area, that is the biggest appeal. There's a lot of people who want to get out of the Bay area. From the perspective of someone with a family: With the astronomical housing costs on the penninsula, working anywhere outside the bay area/penninsula is like getting a 1 to 2 million dollar signing bonus. Even with less than half the pay, you'd be much better off (assuming someplace reasonable: Albequerkee NM, Austin, Dallas, Chicago, Nashville, etc).

Nearly 50% of bay areans want to leave: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/06/04/bay-area-exodus-nearly-...

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#182

Post by what_ever »

mkirklions wrote: post #67
swimorsinka wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 to this. 10 years ago you couldn't make 400K at Google, Facebook, Microsoft, etc. Now you can. Startups made a lot more sense when your opportunity cost was 50-150K per year.

I wonder how sustainable this is. Its 400k while their stock price is crazy high. But If we really are in a tech bubble, that money is back to the typically 80-120k of most tech jobs.

Disagree. You get 400k at FAANG when your base is 150k plus 20% bonus. Sure that bonus will go down to 10% but the rest of the 100k+ stock grant per year is not going to become 0. You would still end up with 225k which is still more than startups.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#183

Post by flybrand »

ronilan wrote: post #37

One of the “weak” points a startup has is the brand perception. Some-role at FANG sounds more impressive than same-role at a no-name startup. Even the startups themselves like to brag that they were started by alumni of brand name employers, rather than alumni of other startups. So, in what concrete way can you shift this? There is no easy solution, but you can try and follow the same route you did for startups. No-n…

I rose in a sales role to be a non-Founder CEO of a material science startup. We were successful - but after 9 years I was burned out and came to a friendly resignation with my board. The name recognition component is real. I got great offers within the industries we sold to - but outside of that there was a lot of explanation about the business, etc.

Brand perception is a real issue - and it doesn't get covered up by your title or role.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#184

Post by kwindla »

dunpeal wrote: post #151
kwindla wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, that's not my experience. I see a lot of people working at startups who got tired of doing things at big companies that just weren't that interesting to them. Those folks have often made enough money that they can afford to work at a startup for a few years because the work itself is more fun, the company has a mission they like, or they appreciate having a bigger day-to-day impact. As a startup founder…

> I see a lot of people working at startups who got tired of doing things at big companies that just weren't that interesting to them. Those folks have often made enough money that they can afford to work at a startup for a few years because the work itself is more fun, the company has a mission they like, or they appreciate having a bigger day-to-day impact. The kind of people you describe are basically retired, and…

I agree about offering early employees as much equity upside as you can (and, just as importantly, a great work environment and team culture).

But I disagree that the kind of people I described are rare, or that they are "basically retired."

That's just not my experience. Many of the most valuable, hard-working engineers I know at startups have a few years of big company experience in their recent past, and are choosing to do the startup thing all in. Sure, because it's "fun" -- but fun doesn't mean fun every day, and it certainly isn't a synonym for easy. Nobody who has done one thinks startups are easy. :-)

Some of us like going to work to do hard things.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#185

Post by cortesoft »

kenhwang wrote: post #9

I echo the comp aspect. I pretty much had a best case non-unicorn startup exit; wonderful benefits pre-acquisition, actual unlimited PTO, and normal ~40hr/workweek, acquired almost immediately after receiving my shares, golden handcuffs after. My total comp was more or less equivalent to my peers doing the big 4 grind over the same time period. They had zero risk and I had to win the start up lotto. But if I had to d…

I think a huge part of whether it is more fun or not is about where you are in life. Startup life was great for me when I was young and single, and enjoyed the startup lifestyle of excitement and risk. Now that I am older and have a wife and kid, I really like the stability, predictability, and salary of a job with a bigger company.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#186

Post by creaghpatr »

HillaryBriss wrote: post #84
davidw wrote: post #29

Here's what I consider the 'sweet spot': A small company, say 20-50 people or thereabouts, that has a profitable niche and does not require much in the way of investments. Here's why: * Small is more fun for me - I like knowing everyone I work with, and the chance to see what other people are working on, and maybe move around some in what I'm doing, rather than 'the same thing day in and day out at BigCo'. Your work…

> You need to avoid things like winner take all markets. i love this idea. yet, it seems like the whole point of startups nowadays is to become the winner in the winner-take-all market. and VCs seem to be looking for that kind of play mainly. and markets become winner-take-all with alarming frequency. so, it's like, how do we get to the kind of market with room for multiple long-term, profitable players?

Markets that have a high barrier of entry and products that require a certain degree of in-house customization. The trade-off is scalability but the gain is that your space won't get slammed (or is less likely to get slammed) with VC-flash funded 'start up' versions of your start up in the medium run.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#187

Post by flybrand »

staunch wrote: post #30

Employment contracts and more equity may be the answer. Contracts are already a feature of some companies for some employees. It would be very interesting if all good startups started doing this for all employees. It might make them a lot more competitive with the big players. It could guarantee that employees walk away with some amount of fully vested stock and cash regardless of why they leave. It could promise a m…

Contracts are tough when the employer isn't able to honor them. That forces the employee to vet the fairness of the offer and the employers ability to pay it out if needed.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#188

Post by sharemywin »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #132
sharemywin wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was a consultant, I liked two things about my company. I was paid by the hour, which kept my company honest. I was paid when I was "on the beach"(bench), but I was expected to train and get tech certifications

Interestingly, I strongly prefer not being paid by the hour. I find time-clocking incredibly irritating, as I may be inspired to a solution or want to fix something outside of hours, which is pretty common for me. And similarly, I don't want to feel bad about if I am doing something wrong or not the most efficiently, but still charging full price for that time. Possibly the most irritating thing for me in times I was…

"And similarly, I don't want to feel bad about if I am doing something wrong or not the most efficiently, but still charging full price for that time."

- A lot of people at the company would feel guilty and put in free hours to the client. (They would usually also get rewarded with excellent customer feedback.)

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#189

Post by sidlls »

drb91 wrote: post #81
toomuchtodo wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Entirely accurate. At a startup, I expect to make ~$100k/year, have mediocre insurance and work life balance, and underwhelming equity ( Unless you’re a founder, I actively steer colleagues away from working at a startup. The sense of accomplishment, impact, or whatever the feel good term is, isn’t worth shorting yourself on significant comp for years (while founders and funds are getting almost all the upside). Edit…

Just to state the obvious, there are things to optimize for other than compensation (like happiness); ~$100k/year provides a comfortable life and saving opportunity in many (most?) parts of the country.

Those other optimizations select for financially independent individuals and young, single individuals coming from an affluent background. It's an oblique way to maintain an "old boys'" network and discriminate by age.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#190

Post by neutrino7 »

0wl3x wrote: post #116
nieksand wrote: post #2

Just a few cons.... The big players have drastically pushed up developer comp. The "maybe" money that might come from a best-case startup exit isn't holding up well against the RSUs of the big players. I have friends pushing total comp north of 400K / year at the usual suspect companies. Over a five-year-span-till-liquidity your "maybe" money is competing against a near-guaranteed $2M in comp. Equity grants for early…

is the compensation really like this for a mid level engineer at a FAANG? I'm still fairly new into my career and I can't believe that the enterprise money is sooo much better than the startup world. I'm currently earning around 120k a year with health insurance and no equity. Should I really be designing on trading up into a nice big enterprise job?

I just started a job as a data scientist at a FAANG company. PhD + 2 years of experience for $200k total compensation (plus another $50k in one time bonuses/relo). It’s almost double what my previous (non-tech) employer paid. Although I’m starting to wonder if I should have gone the software engineering route instead. SWEs get double the RSUs as data scientists for the same experience level (so ~250k for my level) and they also didn’t spend 4 years working on a PhD to get there. Oh well... I can’t complain. Very happy with my current situation.
Post reply on HN