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Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

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Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#91

Post by dolessdrugs »

jiveturkey wrote: post #59
sidlls wrote: post #31

Some pros: More ownership/authority/responsibility over the tech stack means more flexibility and opportunity to shift rapidly when necessary (lots of tech debt potential, though). Smaller teams make communication more efficient. Cons: Compensation is generally terrible. We might expect lower base/cash compensation, but total comp (cash, equity, benefits) is also much lower. The equity portion of compensation is extr…

> Early employees are taking almost as much risk as founders. Why do you say almost ? I'd say most of them are taking more, as most of them won't have a seat at the board, IOW they have less control over the direction of the company.

I bet they mean financial risk, as in personal investment in their own company.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#92

Post by john_moscow »

nieksand wrote: post #2

Just a few cons.... The big players have drastically pushed up developer comp. The "maybe" money that might come from a best-case startup exit isn't holding up well against the RSUs of the big players. I have friends pushing total comp north of 400K / year at the usual suspect companies. Over a five-year-span-till-liquidity your "maybe" money is competing against a near-guaranteed $2M in comp. Equity grants for early…

I think the open secret is that in 2018 most people who go work for startups are those who simply couldn't get a better offer from one of the big players.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#93

Post by rconti »

mkirklions wrote: post #67
swimorsinka wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 to this. 10 years ago you couldn't make 400K at Google, Facebook, Microsoft, etc. Now you can. Startups made a lot more sense when your opportunity cost was 50-150K per year.

I wonder how sustainable this is. Its 400k while their stock price is crazy high. But If we really are in a tech bubble, that money is back to the typically 80-120k of most tech jobs.

But the startups will suffer in the same way.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#94

Post by justboxing »

john_moscow wrote: post #92
nieksand wrote: post #2

Just a few cons.... The big players have drastically pushed up developer comp. The "maybe" money that might come from a best-case startup exit isn't holding up well against the RSUs of the big players. I have friends pushing total comp north of 400K / year at the usual suspect companies. Over a five-year-span-till-liquidity your "maybe" money is competing against a near-guaranteed $2M in comp. Equity grants for early…

I think the open secret is that in 2018 most people who go work for startups are those who simply couldn't get a better offer from one of the big players.

This.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#95

Post by rconti »

swimorsinka wrote: post #12
nieksand wrote: post #2

Just a few cons.... The big players have drastically pushed up developer comp. The "maybe" money that might come from a best-case startup exit isn't holding up well against the RSUs of the big players. I have friends pushing total comp north of 400K / year at the usual suspect companies. Over a five-year-span-till-liquidity your "maybe" money is competing against a near-guaranteed $2M in comp. Equity grants for early…

+1 to this. 10 years ago you couldn't make 400K at Google, Facebook, Microsoft, etc. Now you can. Startups made a lot more sense when your opportunity cost was 50-150K per year.

Basically, startups started taking more funding, and VCs realized there was more money to be made, so they're squeezing the little guy with terms.

A small startup taking less (or no) funding can 'afford' to give more equity to employees, who are effectively providing the capital (in the form of labor) to the business. Today's startups taking huge amounts of funding AND cheap labor are trying to have it both ways.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#96

Post by AjayTripathy »

ryandrake wrote: post #62
swimorsinka wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 to this. 10 years ago you couldn't make 400K at Google, Facebook, Microsoft, etc. Now you can. Startups made a lot more sense when your opportunity cost was 50-150K per year.

You can make that much. You can also win the lottery. Your opportunity cost should not be measured against your best case alternative, it should be measured against a most likely case.

If you want to look the average comp at FAANG or any well-paying public company it's "only" 250k. That versus the average case at a startup being closer to 150k (average options are worth 0).

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#97

Post by avip »

ggregoire wrote: post #11
shamino wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I joined a moderately successful startup (good acquisition where founders made > $1 m) and the rewards were not worth the risks as an early employee. Also, the RSUs are low risk, high rewards at the "usual suspects". Unless you love working on a small team with more autonomy, but without comfortable resources and losing sleep over whether your company will be there next week, I just don't see the attraction of…

> I joined a startup and the rewards were not worth the risks as an early employee. Which risks did you take?

Risk of not being employed by big-paying corp + risk of not having that big-corp on my resume which consequence with the risk of being unemployed for 3-5 months once startup is gone + risk of working nights and w-ends because of reasons + risk of having a tiny network for my next job hunt + risk of pivot every N months + ... maybe I should really quit my startup and apply to Bezosland.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#98

Post by AndrewKemendo »

nieksand wrote: post #2

Just a few cons.... The big players have drastically pushed up developer comp. The "maybe" money that might come from a best-case startup exit isn't holding up well against the RSUs of the big players. I have friends pushing total comp north of 400K / year at the usual suspect companies. Over a five-year-span-till-liquidity your "maybe" money is competing against a near-guaranteed $2M in comp. Equity grants for early…

Yea this is the big one. Even a good exit won't be able to compare monetarily.

Re: Ask HN: Pros and cons of working at a startup in 2018?

#100

Post by ocdtrekkie »

HillaryBriss wrote: post #70
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #22

Having not worked in the Valley or a startup, I can say the biggest con to me is a lack of stability. You can get a job at BigCo or even MediumSizedButBeenAroundTwoDecadesCo and be reasonably sure you'll still have a job... as long as you want to work there. But with a startup, either they run out of money and you lose your job, they pivot and don't need you and you lose your job, or they get acquired and you very li…

I'm not saying this is a bad idea, but, I'll try to argue the other side for a moment: BEGIN THEORY Startups hire in-house devs because, basically, management does not know exactly: A. what to build B. what's possible to build C. how the real world will react to the initial product/service offering and how the company will need to adjust So, they bring devs in close, as high availability, high dedication employees, p…

Is "possible homelessness" a required motivation to ensure you have motivated employees? Note that I don't suggest your entire company would be employed by YC, but that you might fill some roles with people who YC has worked with before and considers of high quality. I would argue in terms of trustworthiness, it is likely "someone YC provides" is more trustworthy than "someone you found on the street". Presumably YC would only retain such employees they found were good at getting fully involved in the companies they put them with, so you'd get the same.

Also, consider that not only could someone be contracted to you in a high availability/all hours arrangement, but that this would potentially also allow YC companies to benefit from roles they couldn't afford to full-time.

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