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Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

nytimes.com

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Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#141

Post by s73v3r_ »

briandear wrote: post #61
the_cat_kittles wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

bring back unions

Are individuals incapable of making decisions on their own? Why shouldn’t the individual have the choice to drive or not drive as well as making decisions about their economic situation? Nobody is forced to drive. Nobody is forced to work for less than they value their labor. Unionizing Uber means dramatically high prices, which means less demand. There isn’t a magic pot of money just waiting to be distributed. If co…

"Are individuals incapable of making decisions on their own?"

You must not think so if you believe they shouldn't have the ability to join a union.

"Nobody is forced to drive"

This whole "nobody is forced to" meme loses any and all credibility once you think for 2 seconds and realize that people are forced to work or starve.

"Let supply and demand work."

We're not the ones stopping it from working; employers are.

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#142

Post by s73v3r_ »

gorpomon wrote: post #70

It's easy to get cynical about the gig economy. But I try and remember that the original spirit of it has been largely successful. The promise of the app economy was that you could take an idea like "I wish I could drive people around for extra money" and make it real, and now it's only real, but for people like my driving-averse mom it's revolutionary. But distortions to the dream have come from all sides. Customers…

"But I try and remember that the original spirit of it has been largely successful."

The spirit of pushing all responsibilities and costs off onto workers?

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#143

Post by mmirate »

nerdponx wrote: post #137
reaperducer wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Anyone who actually thought the gig economy was helping anyone but business owners was either deluded or a shill. Sometimes you just need a quick gig to make ends meet between jobs. Something you can pick up in a day or two and leave just as quickly. Full-time, long-term? No, it's not a great idea. But it's a good safety net when things get tough.

How about an actual social safety net though?

Those systems have a nasty habit of running out of other people's money.

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#144

Post by s73v3r_ »

ProblemFactory wrote: post #89
gorpomon wrote: post #70

It's easy to get cynical about the gig economy. But I try and remember that the original spirit of it has been largely successful. The promise of the app economy was that you could take an idea like "I wish I could drive people around for extra money" and make it real, and now it's only real, but for people like my driving-averse mom it's revolutionary. But distortions to the dream have come from all sides. Customers…

I think one of the main issues is that the current employment classification is too binary. There are independent contractors, who are really independent small businesses: set their own rates, do their own advertising, choose their own customers, and keep all of the profit. And employees, who work for their employer for set hours, and get a stable salary and benefits in return. We need a new third category: dependent…

For what possible reason do we need that third category? What benefit to workers would that bring?

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#145

Post by [deleted] »

coldtea wrote: post #110
mrtksn wrote: post #42

When I first arrived in London my English was not good enough to speak on the phone, I had no idea what the London job market for developers looked like, I had no idea where should I live and where should I settle. So for the first 3-4 months, I did some wine waiting as a gig(agency work, no fixed place or hours. Like with Uber, you provide your own gear - like uniforms, bottle openers etc.) at the finest, the most i…

> So for the first 3-4 months, I did some wine waiting as a gig(agency work, no fixed place or hours. Like with Uber, you provide your own gear - like uniforms, bottle openers etc.) at the finest, the most iconic places in London. I worked at the Shard, I worked at the Cafe Royal, I worked at Four Seasons in events where celebrities like Victoria Beckham or Prince Harry were guests. The the "finest, the most iconic p…

[deleted]

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#146

Post by collyw »

perfmode wrote: post #128
everyone wrote: post #126

For most people (not highly sought after programmers), its an erosion of what paltry remnant of their workers rights remains. Last time wealth inequality peaked, the robber barons had strike breakers and whatnot. This time (with wealth inequality continuing to soar to historically unprecedented heights) they have the 'gig economy'.

but it's a free market! workers are free to not participate in the gig economy. /s

My friend used to use this argument when I complained that Uber / Deliveroo were a bag of crap. I didn´t have a great counterargument, I just mumbled something about workers rights.

What is a convincing argument that this line of thinking is wrong?

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#147

Post by [deleted] »

dandare wrote: post #139
everyone wrote: post #126

For most people (not highly sought after programmers), its an erosion of what paltry remnant of their workers rights remains. Last time wealth inequality peaked, the robber barons had strike breakers and whatnot. This time (with wealth inequality continuing to soar to historically unprecedented heights) they have the 'gig economy'.

Did you even read the article? Gig economy isn't taking over, it slightly declined from 2005.

[deleted]

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#148

Post by abfan1127 »

collyw wrote: post #146
perfmode wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but it's a free market! workers are free to not participate in the gig economy. /s

My friend used to use this argument when I complained that Uber / Deliveroo were a bag of crap. I didn´t have a great counterargument, I just mumbled something about workers rights. What is a convincing argument that this line of thinking is wrong?

there isn't one, unless you think you shouldn't be free to make decisions like participating in the gig economy.

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#149

Post by collyw »

zabzonk wrote: post #76
mrtksn wrote: post #42

When I first arrived in London my English was not good enough to speak on the phone, I had no idea what the London job market for developers looked like, I had no idea where should I live and where should I settle. So for the first 3-4 months, I did some wine waiting as a gig(agency work, no fixed place or hours. Like with Uber, you provide your own gear - like uniforms, bottle openers etc.) at the finest, the most i…

You worked as a sommelier (that's the term, not "wine waiter") at high-cost restaurants without being able to speak rudimentary English? Bollocks.

A French accent , for example, would probably gather more respect, London can be quite a pretentious place at times. (Hell even I would say that the average French person probably knows a lot more about wine than the average Brit).

Re: Maybe the Gig Economy Isn’t Reshaping Work After All

#150

Post by losteric »

dandare wrote: post #139
everyone wrote: post #126

For most people (not highly sought after programmers), its an erosion of what paltry remnant of their workers rights remains. Last time wealth inequality peaked, the robber barons had strike breakers and whatnot. This time (with wealth inequality continuing to soar to historically unprecedented heights) they have the 'gig economy'.

Did you even read the article? Gig economy isn't taking over, it slightly declined from 2005.

Considering they drew parallels with strike breakers, I don't think that was the point.

Many Americans are stuck with dead-end low-wage low/no-benefit part-time jobs (plural) trying to make ends meet - the weak job market offers few alternatives, while the gig economy (ubiquitous temp workers) stands as an implicit threat against workers organizing.

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