Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service • Hacker News Board

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#21

Post by kranner » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 12:57 AM UTC

gabrielroth wrote: post #20

kranner wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As the first commenter on that thread, I can tell you I felt like shit when I read the last comment. And all I told OP was to change the copy a little.

We can't know what was in the guy's head, but it doesn't make sense to me that you'd feel like shit. You suggested he change the copy a little. Someone else asked if he'd consulted a lawyer. Someone else pointed him to the Wikipedia page for Flooz.com, which includes the sentence, "In 2001, Flooz.com was notified by the Federal Bureau of Investigation that a Russian organized crime syndicate was using Flooz and stole…

Thanks, I realize it wasn't my comment that made OP do it. It's just that I found myself leading the lynch mob, without intending it.

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#22

Post by rubypay » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 1:53 AM UTC

Just saw this post about our startup, I'll clarify some things since some people seem interested.

RubyPay was a points based payment system for digital content that anyone could use. Points were bought for cash, and redeemable for cash. It was released because we wanted to generate some feedback on the model.

RubyPay was closed so quickly because we realized some problems, and didn't want any live transactions going through our system that we'd later have to refund. Among some of the problems were:

1) allowing anyone to sell content without a screening process for them or the content

2) allowing consumers to redeem the points for cash, which brought a whole new set of laws into play

3) not anticipating all of the ways that fraud could propagate through the system

We're currently working on the service to address these and other issues. We've also discussed the business further with lawyers, became PCI-DSS compliant, and are in the process of forming industry partnerships. As always thanks for the feedback (there was another discussion thread on HN too), it helped us quickly pivot and iterate on our model, and probably saved us tons of time and headaches.

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#23

Post by sdrinf » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 2:06 AM UTC

jw84 wrote: post #2

As the great warrior-poet Jay-Z once said: "on to the next one, on to the next."

Word of encouragement: "This too shall pass" :)

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#24

Post by rdl » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 2:40 AM UTC

pinksoda wrote: post #3

There is still room for quality payment services like this. In particular, high-risk and micro-payments, would be great niches to get into. The primary problem is that to do this right, you will need to spend a lot on legal fees or find a lawyer to work for equity in your idea(you wouldn't even have a single customer yet). I've run the scenario a million times and I would love to create a start-up that can disrupt, m…

I am sort of interested in doing a vertical-market payment app, similar to paypal, in a well-regulated, legal US market where paypal refuses to transact for utterly bullshit political reasons. There was a recent (2010) player who folded due to internal mismanagement/fraud, but it's fundamentally a pretty good market, and if you can launch a simple payment system in that one, you can move on to other niches.

The problem with a payment system in 2010 vs. 1995 is that credit cards and paypal are "good enough" for most applications. The only niches available are micropayments (never proven to be viable), markets incompatible with paypal or cc (square extends cc; P2P, international, high risk, porn, gaming, other banned things), or non-cash transactions (trading credits for WoW, or gigabytes of storage, etc., might be an option)

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#25

Post by rokhayakebe » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 3:21 AM UTC

jw84 wrote: post #2

As the great warrior-poet Jay-Z once said: "on to the next one, on to the next."

Your timing is perfect. Edit: Had you said 'on to the next one' once, it would be just fine. By saying twice you actually made me sing it. Well done.

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#26

Post by philwelch » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 3:23 AM UTC

sdrinf wrote: post #23

jw84 wrote: post #2

As the great warrior-poet Jay-Z once said: "on to the next one, on to the next."

Word of encouragement: "This too shall pass" :)

"This too shall pass"--encouraging words when a startup doesn't work out, but not the best toast at a wedding.

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#27

Post by parallax7d » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 4:04 AM UTC

rubypay wrote: post #22

Just saw this post about our startup, I'll clarify some things since some people seem interested. RubyPay was a points based payment system for digital content that anyone could use. Points were bought for cash, and redeemable for cash. It was released because we wanted to generate some feedback on the model. RubyPay was closed so quickly because we realized some problems, and didn't want any live transactions going…

Well good luck to you. Don't worry about the haters that say you won't make it because there is no trust built up like the trust users have for Paypal. Who trusted Paypal when they first got started? And many people certainly don't trust them now.

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#28

Post by gommm » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 4:06 AM UTC

jasonlotito wrote: post #19

pinksoda wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The banks only want to drop you if you're attracting too many charge-backs, fraud, or money laundering. If you have a good system in place to minimize these problems, they will gladly take their processing fee from each and every transaction you process and they will do it with a smile. PayPal's automated fraud detection is notoriously inaccurate. They also don't have very good customer service. For years their phone…

> The banks only want to drop you if you're attracting too many charge-backs, fraud, or money laundering. If you have a good system in place to minimize these problems, they will gladly take their processing fee from each and every transaction you process and they will do it with a smile. Wrong. I know this first hand. First, "banks" do not decide whether you process or not. People do, and these people are, in my exp…

If you can talk about it, I would love to read more details about this...

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#29

Post by jacquesm » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 4:15 AM UTC

rubypay wrote: post #22

Just saw this post about our startup, I'll clarify some things since some people seem interested. RubyPay was a points based payment system for digital content that anyone could use. Points were bought for cash, and redeemable for cash. It was released because we wanted to generate some feedback on the model. RubyPay was closed so quickly because we realized some problems, and didn't want any live transactions going…

Good to see you guys pro-active on this, that's better than to end up a few thousand (or worse) in the hole because of fraud and in trouble with the law.

The original thread: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1709481

Re: Thanks for the feedback. I've closed the service

#30

Post by jacquesm » Sat, Sep 25, 2010, 4:26 AM UTC

jasonlotito wrote: post #19

pinksoda wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The banks only want to drop you if you're attracting too many charge-backs, fraud, or money laundering. If you have a good system in place to minimize these problems, they will gladly take their processing fee from each and every transaction you process and they will do it with a smile. PayPal's automated fraud detection is notoriously inaccurate. They also don't have very good customer service. For years their phone…

> The banks only want to drop you if you're attracting too many charge-backs, fraud, or money laundering. If you have a good system in place to minimize these problems, they will gladly take their processing fee from each and every transaction you process and they will do it with a smile. Wrong. I know this first hand. First, "banks" do not decide whether you process or not. People do, and these people are, in my exp…

This comment is dead on, but there is one tiny footnote that I'd like to add.

There have been some less than scrupulous operators of payment systems in the past which have made it much harder for bona-fide operators to get started or to become even moderately successful. The fact that any such service instantly attracts a bunch of money launderers also does not help (that's not fraud from your perspective, but it is illegal and you are instrumental in making it work).