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Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

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Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#61

Post by zemo »

rb808 wrote: post #46

Interesting that he's unsure about Go. Would be nice to hear about why. One huge strength about Node (&Deno) is having the same language and tools on the front end and back end. Its a huge benefit to have a team on one language, even if it might not be the optimal choice. I'm not sure if that is the problem he had with Go though.

the point of Go is to have one language that's the best of both dynamic and static languages. the point of Rust is to be safe and fast. if you're building an infrastructure where you're externalizing the dynamic language runtime, such that there's always a host and a guest language, Go isn't necessarily optimized to act as a host language in that context. Rust is, at the expense of being arguably more tedious to program.

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#62

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

rb808 wrote: post #46

Interesting that he's unsure about Go. Would be nice to hear about why. One huge strength about Node (&Deno) is having the same language and tools on the front end and back end. Its a huge benefit to have a team on one language, even if it might not be the optimal choice. I'm not sure if that is the problem he had with Go though.

I've never understood why this is a benefit when the one language is - let's say - suboptimal in many ways.

The interfaces between server- and client-side code should be well-defined and language-independent. You don't want the same people writing both, because it's harder to check that your API is working to spec if it doesn't get fully independent testing.

There's also a lot of useful server-side optimisation and security management that Node - or a high-level replacement - can't handle.

V8 may improve things, but it's going to have to improve performance a lot to be competitive.

https://www.toptal.com/back-end/server-side-io-performance-n...

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#63

Post by jenscow »

pvsukale3 wrote: post #60

Can anyone explain why he called Dart a complete failure? https://youtu.be/M3BM9TB-8yA?t=19m55s ps: I am a junior developer. I am taking up Dart to learn Mobile apps development using Flutter.

FUD. He's a fan of JS, and probably has no experience with Dart.

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#64

Post by rb808 »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #62
rb808 wrote: post #46

Interesting that he's unsure about Go. Would be nice to hear about why. One huge strength about Node (&Deno) is having the same language and tools on the front end and back end. Its a huge benefit to have a team on one language, even if it might not be the optimal choice. I'm not sure if that is the problem he had with Go though.

I've never understood why this is a benefit when the one language is - let's say - suboptimal in many ways. The interfaces between server- and client-side code should be well-defined and language-independent. You don't want the same people writing both, because it's harder to check that your API is working to spec if it doesn't get fully independent testing. There's also a lot of useful server-side optimisation and s…

> The interfaces between server- and client-side code should be well-defined and language-independent.

They dont have to be and that is the point. If you write JS/TS front and back you can make everything much simpler with the associated benefits.

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#65

Post by thosakwe »

pvsukale3 wrote: post #60

Can anyone explain why he called Dart a complete failure? https://youtu.be/M3BM9TB-8yA?t=19m55s ps: I am a junior developer. I am taking up Dart to learn Mobile apps development using Flutter.

I wouldn't say Dart is a failure at all.

That being said, the Dart project has long abandoned the goal of replacing JavaScript in the browser, and instead provides a VM, Flutter, and a to-JS compiler.

Many people do not know this, and have written the language off entirely. Hence a lot of the negative reaction to Flutter.

(Though, if I'm quite honest, this is a bit off-topic from the OP)

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#66

Post by myth_buster »

wereHamster wrote: post #56
t-sauer wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could have an entry file for your dependencies (let's say dependencies.ts) and reexport everything from there. When you have to update, you only have to upgrade it in the entry file and you can avoid multiple versions.

Hm, how about we call that file package.json?

How about we link them to modules downloaded onto local file system instead, just in case of network issues.

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#67

Post by Joeri »

sametmax wrote: post #24
mromanuk wrote: post #4

I was thinking, watching the video "Ryan should fork it, or start over"... until he revealed it: https://github.com/ry/deno :)

My head can't wrap itself around: import { test } from " https://unpkg.com/deno_testing@0.0.5/testing.ts" There is so many issues with that I don't even no where to begin.

Actually, I can’t think of a single issue that npm doesn’t also have.

Possible issues:

- trust

Not an issue since if you trust an author’s packages on npmjs you should also trust them from unpkg, github, etc... (Aka there is no trust in npm land except trust in the author)

- Versioning

Put the version in the url instead of some json, same difference.

- Lack of ^ for automatic upgrades

That’s a feature. Avoids the need for lock files.

- Repetitive

Have a dependencies.ts to group external imports, same thing as package.json

Any other issues?

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#68

Post by always_good »

uqimerioni wrote: post #49

WTF slide brought be here. In the world where Python and Ruby exist - calling javascript best dynamic language is nothing but heresy.

How?

Javascript has a lot going for it from async-everything to conveniences like destructuring. And it works in the browser and has things like Typescript.

I have to find good reasons to use another dynamically-typed language over Javascript.

Re: Things I Regret About Node.js [video]

#70

Post by Scarbutt »

pvsukale3 wrote: post #60

Can anyone explain why he called Dart a complete failure? https://youtu.be/M3BM9TB-8yA?t=19m55s ps: I am a junior developer. I am taking up Dart to learn Mobile apps development using Flutter.

Flutter is relatively new compared to when Dart was created, Dart initial goal was to be a language for web programming, outside of google, I think almost everyone agrees it failed at that.

They have change their mind many times about the design/future of the language, the churn is still experienced today, see Dart 2.0 (not released as stable yet), which some would say its a new language from Dart 1.0.

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