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What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

jacquesmattheij.com

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Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#111

Post by cube2222 »

beagle3 wrote: post #103
cube2222 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well yes, Windows 10, finally a practically usable Windows in my opinion. Finally working, with a lot of polish and Dev tools available. (Like wsl)

It was pushed down the throat of customers, using dark patterns and “better ask forgiveness than permission” ethics. It also took away choice from the vast majority of users, and started sending opaque and vaguely described telemetry. The problem with Microsoft wasn’t that their software sucks (some does, some is great). It is that they have been bullying users and companies for the past 30 years. Many people point t…

Yea, the telemetry one was kind of shady at the beginning, when it got turned on again after every update. That's changed a while ago though, and you can actually look through all the telemetry you're sending.

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#112

Post by lewisj489 »

gressquel wrote: post #43

I myself am optimistic but some few questrions popped up: Microsoft is very proactive removing things from azure and shutting down sites as soon as they receive DMCA complaint or abuse complaint. Are they going to remove important github repos like these if they get DMCA or other complaints? https://github.com/Roy47Zhang/CSGO-Aimbot-Project (cheat for Counter strike) https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl (download from v…

Complaints should be respected and violating repos should be taken down.

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#113

Post by ekianjo »

raesene9 wrote: post #38
RyanZAG wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows 10 is really recent though. That said, since I like controversy: I'm happier to see Microsoft buy Github than I would be to see Google or Facebook buy it. And also! A big shoutout to Linus for helping to make source control distributed and open, which means swapping between git providers (for the code at least) is simple, easy and impossible to block. The amount of good Linus has done for the world is incredi…

I think MS made mis-steps on the Windows 10 privacy setup for sure, although they've largely fixed it in later releases with improved visibility of Privacy options and better docs on how to disable most of the telemetry stuff. Personally I like Windows 10 as a general purpose client OS, WSL is great and stability for me across a number of devices has been very good.

Yeah but they reset your privacy settings with every update. Thats what we call dark patterns.

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#114

Post by jgaa »

raesene9 wrote: post #4

The idea that some companies must be forever tainted by their misdeads in the past seems odd to me. Companies change leadership, direction and style and it seems odd to suggest that there's some underlying quality which means that, regardless of that, you can never trust them (or in reverse that you should always trust a company you once trusted) There seems to be a trope with Microsoft that they're still the same co…

I have been around since Microsoft's core product was Basic under CP/M. It was not so bad. Later, Microsoft had one of the best debuggers for Unix. I used it every day for years.

Then Microsoft became bigger and bigger and they did that by becoming increasingly Evil.

The problem with Microsoft today is not that all their technology is bad, sluggish and annoying. They still have some competent developers working there. The problem is that although they put on a lot of lipstick - they are still dead Evil. They want your data. They want to do all the bad things Amazon, Facebook and Google (data mining) Apple (exclusive sales of Windows applications trough their store - and forcing you to have their music, xbox and other crap installed on your computer).

The only reason Microsoft is not generally regarded as Evil today is share incompetence. They don't know how to make an instant messenger - so Skype is useless and people use other programs. They don't know how to make a large website - so Linkedin is just as useless as Skype. People leave.

Nokia is the best example of Microsoft's incompetence. They buy the most successful phone brand in the history of the world - and in just a few years it's over. The employees are fired, nobody wants the phones, and their appstore is a wasteland of useless crap nobody wants (that's what happens when quantity (number of 'apps') is the only measurement for 'success').

Microsoft wants your data. They want video-cameras in your home. They want to listen in to what you talk about in your bedroom. They want to sell that data to 'Partners', advertisers and law enforcement. They want to be Amazon, Google, Apple and Facebook - but they have no idea about how to make anything that people actually wants. So they buy successful enterprises, redeploy their army of managers from hell there, and turns it into dirt. That happened to Nokia. That happened to Skype. I think that was what happened to Linkedin (I don't know the inside story, just that it quickly became useless). Now they want to do the same to github. So sad.

For developers, it's not a question about to leave or not to leave. It's just a question about when. No matter how much you love or hate Microsoft - they will for sure turn github into dirt - like everything they touch - and then at some point you will leave. Eventually you'll have to leave in 2 years when the shut it down.

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#115

Post by badsectoracula »

raesene9 wrote: post #45
mpartel wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another recent example: lockdown of ARM-based Windows machines, preventing the installation of other operating systems.

Lockdown of consumer grade devices isn't really a new experience (e.g. iOS devices). There's a trade-off to be had between security/reliability and flexibility. If MS were selling those devices as general purpose computers and then refusing to allow other OS installation, I think that would be dishonest, however as far as I'm aware they're not making such claims.

> If MS were selling those devices as general purpose computers

They are computers, regardless of what sort of dress they wear, and users should have control over their own computing devices.

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#116

Post by SmellyGeekBoy »

vortico wrote: post #64
gressquel wrote: post #43

I myself am optimistic but some few questrions popped up: Microsoft is very proactive removing things from azure and shutting down sites as soon as they receive DMCA complaint or abuse complaint. Are they going to remove important github repos like these if they get DMCA or other complaints? https://github.com/Roy47Zhang/CSGO-Aimbot-Project (cheat for Counter strike) https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl (download from v…

What's wrong with this? I don't want unauthorized infringing projects jeopardizing the service the rest of us use legally and ethically. Invalid DMCAs are another story, but what's the harm of respecting an IP owner's valid DMCA request?

Indeed. "I'll leave if they dare comply with the law" seems like a strange argument, even if you disagree with the laws in question. What if it's your copyrights / patents that are being infringed?

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#117

Post by raesene9 »

mpartel wrote: post #95
raesene9 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lockdown of consumer grade devices isn't really a new experience (e.g. iOS devices). There's a trade-off to be had between security/reliability and flexibility. If MS were selling those devices as general purpose computers and then refusing to allow other OS installation, I think that would be dishonest, however as far as I'm aware they're not making such claims.

I don't see the tradeoff honestly. Sure, make it a little difficult, show a big red scary warning, perhaps even require the use of a screwdriver to discourage "casual" users from being misled into compromising their machine's security. But ultimately true ownership, recyclability/reusability (Linux on aging hardware..), and hardware-independent OS competition are norms with significant benefits that we shouldn't give…

Those may be norms for IT professionals, but the needs of IT professionals are very different from those of standard users.

Realistically most people (numerically) don't want a computer, they want a thing that lets them communicate, create and consume content.

Lockdown isn't a problem for them, and walled gardens like iOS are generally the best way for them to stay secure.

If you provide a method to escape the sandbox, it is likely that attackers will work out how to exploit that. For example try going to facebook.com and open the developers tools. They've had to put a warning in there to stop people from "self-XSS" ...

Re: What is wrong with Microsoft buying GitHub

#119

Post by zeusk »

dfcowell wrote: post #52
onion2k wrote: post #13

Assuming GitHub was actually losing money and couldn't fix that problem quickly enough it's fair to assume they had to sell, and it's reasonable to believe there aren't that many companies who could have bought them if you think an understanding of the domain is important, then you're really limited to Facebook (user surveillance, adverts), Apple (bad at software, not developer friendly), Google (user surveillance, a…

Microsoft don't have a competing product in their portfolio to extinguish Github in favour of - and any overt moves like kicking projects off the platform would instantly torpedo any value the acquisition brought as every single project left the service in protest. I don't really see how anything other than being perfect stewards of Github works out in their favour.

> Microsoft don't have a competing product in their portfolio to extinguish Github in favour of

Actually they did (VSTS, TFS), but it was so hilariously bad that they started moving to git a couple years ago.

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