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American tech giants are making life tough for startups

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Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#61

Another reminder, alongside the apparent Microsoft GitHub acquision, that regulators need to step up and prevent large tech firms from acting anti competitively. From another Economist article ("How to Tame the Tech Titans", https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/01/18/how-to-tame-the... ): > Two broad changes of thinking would go a long way towards sensibly taming the titans. The first is to make better use of exist…

Seeing that Github is reportedly unprofitable, if they aren't acquired by a profitable company, what's the alternative? What do you think Microsoft would do to harm Github? I doubt it would be as bad as what became of SourceForge.

If I had a stake in Github, I would be delighted to sell it to Microsoft.

I don't have a stake in Github. I am a user with 2 distinct roles. In one role, I work for a company that pays for Github's services. Github has done a very good job hiring people who have maintained the service as it scaled to very high levels. I am concerned that Microsoft will be unable or even unwilling to keep those teams intact. They may wish to restructure the organisation. They may wish to change middle management in an attempt to make it profitable, etc, etc. Github has had a good track record with us. Organisationally we have no experience with Microsoft, so it's a risk.

Personally, I spent a chunk of my career working in the MS world (working with gold/platinum level partners). This is ancient history by now (10 years ago), but my experience with MS support was abysmal. Essentially "support" amounted to having a telephone number where I could report issues. No follow up allowed. No notification if the issue was ever resolved. Upgrade to the next version when it comes out and check for yourself to see if it has been fixed. Hey, that's why we pay for those MSDN subscriptions! Though, if you have about 1000 seats in your license, you can get real support (if you are lucky). Maybe that's all changed and they are fantastic, but once bitten twice shy as they say.

In my other role as a consumer with Github, I have my personal repositories there. I still vividly remember MS's push to create a division between "hobbyists" and "professional developers". The idea was to provide different levels of access based on the idea that "professional developers" work for large companies that will pay for high licensing fees and extensive support contracts (which only really seem to count if you have at least 1000 seats... see above). "Hobbyists" are intentionally crippled by giving them just enough access to seem like they can do something, but denying them crucial things.

With the release of VSCode, etc, I can see that the company has changed, but old ideas die hard. 10 or 15 years is not enough time for me to feel like I can trust the company. Will they slowly screw me over by using their dominant position to "boil the frog" -- slowly crippling their "hobbyists" without ever doing anything overt enough to cause them to jump out of the pot? Only time will tell, but yes I'm quite concerned. To be fair, MS is not the only potential purchaser who would concern me. At least it isn't Oracle!

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#62
> Big tech firms have been known to intimidate startups into agreeing to a sale, saying that they will launch a competing service and put the startup out of business unless they agree to a deal...

> Big tech firms are able to shell out huge sums to keep top performers and even average employees in their fold and make it uneconomical for their workers to consider joining startups.

Reminds me so much of the show Silicon Valley. A great satire!

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#63
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And housing is even more expensive in San Francisco than in Seattle, general cost of living is a bit higher, and CA has income taxes, adjust the figures accordingly. The $1.3m house in Seattle will cost you $2m in SF. Now you need $500,000 for a down payment. Your mortgage + taxes will cost you $110,000 per year, out of your $158,000 take home on a $250,000 income. You'll burn $3.8 million over 30 years on the equiva…

That's not how the math works at all. 25-30 yr olds making 250k don't live in 2m homes. They usually share an apartment in SF and pay ~$2000-2500 on rent. Then when it is time to get married or move in with a gf, you get a starter home for 500-600K, putting 10% down. Now in a couple of years, your starter home has gained $200k in value. Sell that and use the proceeds for a larger single family home around 1-1.5mn. Me…

No, they move there because they hope that math works out that way, and they think they will be the one guy out of 10? 20? 100? where it actually does work out.

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#64
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Engineers in sf make a lot more than 150k in their late 20s/early 30s even outside big 5

And housing is even more expensive in San Francisco than in Seattle, general cost of living is a bit higher, and CA has income taxes, adjust the figures accordingly. The $1.3m house in Seattle will cost you $2m in SF. Now you need $500,000 for a down payment. Your mortgage + taxes will cost you $110,000 per year, out of your $158,000 take home on a $250,000 income. You'll burn $3.8 million over 30 years on the equiva…

But at this rate in 30 years that modest middle class house will be worth 2.6 billion dollars!

(kidding. I think).

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#65

Another reminder, alongside the apparent Microsoft GitHub acquision, that regulators need to step up and prevent large tech firms from acting anti competitively. From another Economist article ("How to Tame the Tech Titans", https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/01/18/how-to-tame-the... ): > Two broad changes of thinking would go a long way towards sensibly taming the titans. The first is to make better use of exist…

Seeing that Github is reportedly unprofitable, if they aren't acquired by a profitable company, what's the alternative? What do you think Microsoft would do to harm Github? I doubt it would be as bad as what became of SourceForge.

"Seeing that Github is reportedly unprofitable, if they aren't acquired by a profitable company, what's the alternative?"

Lay off employees until they're profitable.

Tech companies tend to invest ahead of growth, because tech markets tend to be winner-take-all and if the market grows when you don't, somebody else will take the market. They're effectively using their employees as insurance to make sure nobody else can catch them in the market.

As a result, they often have orders of magnitude more employees than is necessary to keep the lights on, the product operational, and the money flowing in (at least in the short term). Google, for example, really just needs datacenter ops technicians and SREs to keep the product up, which is maybe 2% of their current headcount. If they laid everyone else off, they'd eventually become vulnerable to a competitor or lawsuit or public opinion or unhappy/indifferent customers. But until that happened, they could maintain quite hefty profits.

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#66
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not a monopoly - a monopoly would be if for at minimum one of those things, you could only find a Google-controlled version.

That's not true, but it's close; at least according to US law. Microsoft was deemed a monopoly in 2000 (which is actually legal) and abused it's monopolistic powers (which is not legal) while other OS's existed in the market: Apple, BeOS, Novell, Linux, OS/2, etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Cor... .

As you know, Microsoft had more than 90% of the OS market worldwide. While other OSes did exist, they didn’t provide meaningful competition. The person to which you replied meant that Google Milk is only a problem if Google abuses its search monopoly to push the market away from other milk vendors, not that Google isn’t a monopoly as long as another search engine exists. Their main point was that it isn’t abusing a monopoly to launch a broad array of products if each of those products compete in a fair market.

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#67
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is after you include stock. Not a bad deal today, but I'm still questioning if 1 trillion dollar companies exist or are overvalued.

That is a fair point. Liquid salary doesn't usually go much beyond 200k; all of the additional comp is in RSU's. If there is a huge downturn, a lot of engineers will lose a great chunk of their assets.

My current "quarter life crisis" is around this number, it appears to getting from $150-200k in liquid salary is MUCH more difficult than $100-150. So if liquid income is your "north star metric" job wise, what do you do?

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, joke is on us, because they'll still develop the thing they told the pentagon they would develop, all while appearing to be 'good guys' to people (which is apparently quite a few people) who don't understand how contracts work.

New ReCAPTCHA: select the correct person for a drone strike to proceed.

I don't think it's original to him, but Joey Hess (joeyh on Hacker News) posted an image of that concept:

https://joeyh.name/blog/entry/prove_you_are_not_an_Evil_corp...

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#69

Another reminder, alongside the apparent Microsoft GitHub acquision, that regulators need to step up and prevent large tech firms from acting anti competitively. From another Economist article ("How to Tame the Tech Titans", https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/01/18/how-to-tame-the... ): > Two broad changes of thinking would go a long way towards sensibly taming the titans. The first is to make better use of exist…

Seeing that Github is reportedly unprofitable, if they aren't acquired by a profitable company, what's the alternative? What do you think Microsoft would do to harm Github? I doubt it would be as bad as what became of SourceForge.

> What do you think Microsoft would do to harm Github?

GVFS. I believe Github will only deploy to Microsoft's GVFS sometime after acquisition. This is one of the more obvious plans, I thought shrug

Re: American tech giants are making life tough for startups

#70
I once got a legal threat from facebook when I was setting up an app because I registered a domain to serve my app assets with a name like myappfacebookorigin.com and it said that the word facebook is famous and I need to cease and desist. I wish they had paid me back for the domain or forced the registrars to warn me I would get legal threats for using their trademarked name.
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