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China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

economist.com

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Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#111

Post by [deleted] »

cromwellian wrote: post #99
thevardanian wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason we don't accuse Buddhism when a Buddhist commits violence is because very rarely do they explicitly say they're committing whatever they're doing in the name of their religion, nor in anyway to propagate their religion. That is to say, you don't have a doctrinal, linear, absolute, form of religiosity that demands conversion, demands superiority, demands singularity as is fundamental to Islam. Muhammad and…

Are you seriously suggesting that Nationalism itself can't be a violent religion?

[deleted]

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#112

Post by ShabbosGoy »

eanzenberg wrote: post #80
ShabbosGoy wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is you are considered Anti-Semitic if you criticize the government of Israel. So you cannot even talk about it in public, or it will ruin your reputation and career. Edit: The karma of my comment proves my point.

In tech and in other liberal fields as academia it is the reverse: critique of islam, muslims, their treatment of women and education, is mostly forbidden unless you’re ok with being ostracized.

I also work in tech, I just don’t discuss anything remotely controversial IRL because it will end up offending someone. Recently, I made the mistake to actually speak what was really on my mind (when I was drunk) and I ended up getting physically assaulted which led to a concussion. Suffice it to say I will never talk about politics publicly ever again.

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#113

Post by nafizh »

curyous wrote: post #63
nafizh wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The problem is people clinging to old time religious beliefs that women are inferior and must be veiled and that infidels are not worthy Wow, such an uninformed generalized comment. Not something you would expect to see at hacker news. Anyway, just because the West had problems with Christianity does not mean the East have the same problems with Islam. That is one of the reasons why Islam has more practicing followe…

Can you shed some light?

This is a good resource to learn about some of the more ‘controversial’ topics in Islam like apostasy or the position of women.

https://yaqeeninstitute.org/en/research/

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#114

Post by titanix2 »

boomboomsubban wrote: post #88
titanix2 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is funny you take the example of Christians community in the Middle East, because right now they are precisely the target of Sunnis terrorists and in great danger. A few month ago, a Libanese bishop was saying in a newspaper that "Christians will inevitably disappear from the Middle-East, even from Lebanon". He predicted that to happen in the timeframe of a decade. [1] https://www.lorientlejour.com/article/1110721…

No, it's not funny. A century or two of attacks on the region from Christians has soured relationships in the area, but those Lebanese Christians lived in Muslim controlled areas for over a millennium. By comparison, Muslims in Spain were immediately forced to convert or leave, and in 200 years any ember of the religion was dead. The current situation stems from much more than just religious choice.

You are rewriting history. The actual Lebanon territory contained Christians centuries before it became muslim. And it became a muslim territory after conquests. The fact that most regions of the world where there is muslim believers (Middle East, some parts of Europe and of the Indian subcontinent, Maghreb) is because of military conquest is telling. The only place this religion spread peacefully is South-Asia.

The Spanish case is also totally different and you can't blame them to get back again their territory and hold a grudge against the religion of their former invaders. I agree however that this is more complex than a simple religion choice, because in most case, this is not a choice (especially centuries ago) and its intertwined with a lot of other factors.

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#115

Post by whatsstolat »

em3rgent0rdr wrote: post #89
igivanov wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In other news, the US, NATO and friends in this century alone destroyed Iraq, Libya, almost destroyed Syria and Yemen and did a few other nasty things that resulted in at least a million dead. Do you have a big enough item 5 for that?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Parent makes a point though. Should we boycott everything?

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#117

Post by dvfjsdhgfv »

thevardanian wrote: post #91
cromwellian wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all Islam is the same. Indonesian islamic culture is not the same as Turkish, or Arabian. It's way too simplistic to lump the situation of every country together. Are a minority of the people of Xinjiang committing violent acts because they want a Caliphate and to convert Han chinese, or are they doing it because the Uighurs are treated very badly by the Chinese government and they want autonomy and rallying arou…

The reason we don't accuse Buddhism when a Buddhist commits violence is because very rarely do they explicitly say they're committing whatever they're doing in the name of their religion, nor in anyway to propagate their religion. That is to say, you don't have a doctrinal, linear, absolute, form of religiosity that demands conversion, demands superiority, demands singularity as is fundamental to Islam. Muhammad and…

> In a similar sense not all religions are the same.

This is the one single point that is very hard to accept by the mainstream. Currently, the doctrine of all cultures being equal is something universal. If we accept the opposite view, there are many dangers on the way. Who is going to decide which culture/religion is better? By what criteria? What are the consequences? It's safer to declare equality, and this is what happened in the West - and any attempt to question that is perceived as a regressive view.

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#118

Post by IkmoIkmo »

yoavm wrote: post #79
ironjunkie wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gaza is not a religion problem, it is a human right problem. Israel is scandalously denying human people living in Gaza any dignity in their living, after stealing their land and oppressing them for years. I'm sick to see how much America is getting complicit with this. and happy to see that most of Europe realizes what is really going on there.

Do you know many people in Gaza? Because I do and they complain much more about Hamas than they do about Israel. I'm far from agreeing with Israel's policies regarding Gaza, but the truth is it's far from being Gaza's biggest problem. Not to mention the often forgetten fact that Gaza has another border, with Egypt, which is closed, and Israel has nothing to do with it. A Gazan friend told me this very week actually t…

> Not to mention the often forgetten fact that Gaza has another border, with Egypt, which is closed, and Israel has nothing to do with it.

Suppose a universe in which Israel didn't exist. Would Egypt have closed off its border with Gaza? Not a chance. That means it has everything to do with Israel. If you think Israel and its allies wouldn't respond with pressure on Egypt the moment it'd open up a border with Gaza, precisely because of Israel, you're fooling yourself.

As for your anecdotal stories about a friend in Gaza, they're as meaningless as if I said I had a Gazan friend who said the opposite.

The notion you've got Gazans risking their lives protesting against Israel (with over ten thousand injuries and 100 dead in the past months, 100% Palestinian) but not Hamas apparently isn't telling to you.

And if you think Palestinian lack of satisfaction with its leaders at any point in its history (e.g. Hamas now) has nothing to do with Israeli oppression (including the closed borders and the destruction of Palestinian economy every time there's an lopsided violent clash) with the backing of the world's superpower, you're also fooling yourself.

Re: China has turned Xinjiang into a police state like no other

#120

Post by whatsstolat »

Roritharr wrote: post #6

Besides this being dystopian out of the western libertarian pov, i wonder what it actually does against crime? I imagine a crime free city would be an interesting human phenomenon without equal. The side effects of there not being any undetected and unprosecuted crime would be fascinating.

Sounds like there is plenty of crime in that city. False imprisonment, extrajudicial killings, harassment, blackmail.
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