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Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

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Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#101

Post by LinuxBender »

jerheinze wrote: post #93
LinuxBender wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are interesting preferences and perspectives. I will set up a site to counter them from my perspective and experiences. To summarize, you are a dissident. I am a news reporter. You are giving me information about your government. Your life and the lives of your family members now depend 100% on the security of the Tor Proxy transport. Tor is a proxy transport and nothing more. As a dissident, you have been trai…

> Without HTTPS, you are relying entirely on the transport for assurance of who you are talking to. That's not the case, even with a SecureDrop setup, a Gov can compromise your SecureDrop machine and listen directly.

Exactly, they have to pop my machine too. They can't just take control of the traffic in the middle, which absolutely can be done in Tor with enough gov controlled guard nodes, as the arms race of patching has proven.

I can set up multiple canaries that they will have to pop and the fingerprint of one of those canaries is going to change or drop off the net.

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#102

Post by jabn76 »

kbrackbill wrote: post #86
Exuma wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by this: "with that the risk of being arrested for all sorts of criminal activity by non-tech-savvy law enforcement" You can be arrested for things just by using Tor if they mix you up with someone else or something?

You can be arrested for running an exit node, because other Tor users' traffic will appear to be coming from you. For example: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/05/01/russian-tor-exit-node-... https://www.zdnet.com/article/dan-egerstads-tor-exit-nodes-g... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2452320/tor-exit-node-operat...

Looks like a cheap escape from jail card.

Run an exit node and then do something illegal. Then blame it on someone else.

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#103

Post by jacekm »

cup-of-tea wrote: post #68
ComodoHacker wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimatest super-goal: make anonymity the default stance and socially accepted norm. Do with anonymous browsing what WhatsApp did with E2E encryption. Force big data suckers to invent new business models for exploiting our data without breaching our privacy.

> what WhatsApp did with E2E encryption Convince everyone that using a closed source, proprietary app is good security?

WhatsApp is not perfect and certainly its code not being available for inspection is one of its flaws. However, it did bring security to the masses. I mean I am pretty sure the security it offers is enough for 95% of people. I would not use it for sending documents stolen from NSA, but for the rest of cases - it gets you covered. Security very often need to be balanced with convenience - with WhatsApp you get immense boost of protection without sacrificing much convenience. One could argue, that you could get better security with Signal - true, but first you'd need to convince all your family and friends to install it.

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#104

Post by cpeterso »

forapurpose wrote: post #57

What will Mozilla do about the Tor network's usability problems? Advanced users can workaround them and because they understand the benefits and engineering, accept the frustrations as a cost for a worthwhile (and free) technology. But what will non-technical users do? Many public Internet websites filter connections from the Tor network, many other websites are very slow, yet others impose extra obstacles such as mu…

Mozilla used to run some Tor exit nodes. I don't know if that is still the case.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2877592/mozilla-puts-old-har... (2015)

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#105

Post by Exuma »

jerheinze wrote: post #91
kbrackbill wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can be arrested for running an exit node, because other Tor users' traffic will appear to be coming from you. For example: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/05/01/russian-tor-exit-node-... https://www.zdnet.com/article/dan-egerstads-tor-exit-nodes-g... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2452320/tor-exit-node-operat...

All of them from people running their exit from home, which has always been warned against.

Where is the recommended place to run one?

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#106

Post by tinus_hn »

jacekm wrote: post #103
cup-of-tea wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what WhatsApp did with E2E encryption Convince everyone that using a closed source, proprietary app is good security?

WhatsApp is not perfect and certainly its code not being available for inspection is one of its flaws. However, it did bring security to the masses. I mean I am pretty sure the security it offers is enough for 95% of people. I would not use it for sending documents stolen from NSA, but for the rest of cases - it gets you covered. Security very often need to be balanced with convenience - with WhatsApp you get immense…

You also get encryption while your traffic looks just the same as everybody else’s. You don’t stand out like when you’re using Tor.

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#107

Post by Yoric »

benevol wrote: post #97
jerheinze wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of them from people running their exit from home, which has always been warned against.

Just use some cheap VPN service in front of your Tor/Firefox browser (which most people should do in any case) and you're good to go.

How does this affect exit nodes?

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#108

Post by jerheinze »

jabn76 wrote: post #102
kbrackbill wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can be arrested for running an exit node, because other Tor users' traffic will appear to be coming from you. For example: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/05/01/russian-tor-exit-node-... https://www.zdnet.com/article/dan-egerstads-tor-exit-nodes-g... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2452320/tor-exit-node-operat...

Looks like a cheap escape from jail card. Run an exit node and then do something illegal. Then blame it on someone else.

Why take that trouble when they can do it directly using Tor without running any exit at home? Also for instance Bogatov had an alibi when that happened.

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#109

Post by drexlspivey »

jabn76 wrote: post #102
kbrackbill wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can be arrested for running an exit node, because other Tor users' traffic will appear to be coming from you. For example: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/05/01/russian-tor-exit-node-... https://www.zdnet.com/article/dan-egerstads-tor-exit-nodes-g... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2452320/tor-exit-node-operat...

Looks like a cheap escape from jail card. Run an exit node and then do something illegal. Then blame it on someone else.

Did you miss the part where exit node operators are getting arrested?

Re: Mozilla Project Fusion: Tor Integration into Firefox

#110

Post by jerheinze »

benevol wrote: post #97
jerheinze wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of them from people running their exit from home, which has always been warned against.

Just use some cheap VPN service in front of your Tor/Firefox browser (which most people should do in any case) and you're good to go.

That has no relation to the cases above which were of people running Tor exit nodes from their home. If one wants to hide their Tor usage then that's something else and there are pluggable transports that are already built-in the Tor Browser to obfuscate Tor traffic to look like something else--no need for a VPN.
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