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Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

blog.nightly.mozilla.org

61–70 of 126 posts

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#61
post #3

> While sophisticated users can turn to cloud-based “open resolvers” Sophisticated users run their own resolvers instead of relying on unverifiable promises from for-profit entities.

And how do these sophisticated users populate their own revolvers if not plain DNS, DNS over TLS, or DNS over HTTPS? There is no such thing as hosting a globally distributed database from your house.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#62

No, no no and no. It does not improve privacy, it just puts all your DNS history in the hands of one provider. Not only that it adds latency for no real gain. HTTP is a terrible protocol for anything time sensitive. (its a fairly bad protocol for anything fast or efficient full stop.) The better way to do this is encourage/provide DNSsec (so we know that a provider is who they say they are) and then encrypt dns queri…

DNS over TLS exists as well. DNS over HTTPS is just another format for DNS over TLS.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#63
Imagine if this became the default with only Cloudflare as a provider. Firefox users in countries all over the World will not be able to visit a website locally or anywhere else without asking an American corporation for the IP address first.

I mean. I can't believe that there are going to be a lot of alternative providers. It's going to be an expensive service to provide. Especially when one of the requirements is that you can't mine the data to recuperate costs (and rightly so).

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#64
post #57
post #24

Why would I want my browser to do this? My browser should use the DNS configured by my OS -- in my case, a local, caching resolving NS. If I want to use some kind of DNS-over-HTTP I'll tell my OS to do it. I don't want my browser making DNS decisions for me. What am I missing?

I used this at some point on my Fedora laptop. I had issues on some hotel APs where it didn't allow me to see the 'login page' of the AP. What's the way to circumvent this problem? I'm frequently on public wifi's, so I need to access AP login pages without issue.

Such captive portals are a pain anyway, even more reasons for providers to stop doing this — hijacking DNS requests.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#65

No, no no and no. It does not improve privacy, it just puts all your DNS history in the hands of one provider. Not only that it adds latency for no real gain. HTTP is a terrible protocol for anything time sensitive. (its a fairly bad protocol for anything fast or efficient full stop.) The better way to do this is encourage/provide DNSsec (so we know that a provider is who they say they are) and then encrypt dns queri…

And what happens when I stay at a hotel and need to access the login page of the local lan?

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#66
post #62

No, no no and no. It does not improve privacy, it just puts all your DNS history in the hands of one provider. Not only that it adds latency for no real gain. HTTP is a terrible protocol for anything time sensitive. (its a fairly bad protocol for anything fast or efficient full stop.) The better way to do this is encourage/provide DNSsec (so we know that a provider is who they say they are) and then encrypt dns queri…

DNS over TLS exists as well. DNS over HTTPS is just another format for DNS over TLS.

In my opinion we don't want TLS at all, but rather a UDP based protocol, so that the latency advantages of DNS aren't lost. I believe DNSCurve solves this.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#67
post #57
post #24

Why would I want my browser to do this? My browser should use the DNS configured by my OS -- in my case, a local, caching resolving NS. If I want to use some kind of DNS-over-HTTP I'll tell my OS to do it. I don't want my browser making DNS decisions for me. What am I missing?

I used this at some point on my Fedora laptop. I had issues on some hotel APs where it didn't allow me to see the 'login page' of the AP. What's the way to circumvent this problem? I'm frequently on public wifi's, so I need to access AP login pages without issue.

The real solution is for the captive portal is to signal that there is a captive portal.

Unfortunately that has turned into an arms race: some operating systems switch to a different browser when they detect a captive portal. So captive portals try to avoid detection, etc.

Basically what you want is package that tries to detect a captive portal and when it detects one alerts the user and offer to start a browser that uses the DHCP-supplied DNS resolvers to interact with the portal.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#68
post #66
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DNS over TLS exists as well. DNS over HTTPS is just another format for DNS over TLS.

In my opinion we don't want TLS at all, but rather a UDP based protocol, so that the latency advantages of DNS aren't lost. I believe DNSCurve solves this.

If you want UDP, DNS over DTLS also exists.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#69
post #65

No, no no and no. It does not improve privacy, it just puts all your DNS history in the hands of one provider. Not only that it adds latency for no real gain. HTTP is a terrible protocol for anything time sensitive. (its a fairly bad protocol for anything fast or efficient full stop.) The better way to do this is encourage/provide DNSsec (so we know that a provider is who they say they are) and then encrypt dns queri…

And what happens when I stay at a hotel and need to access the login page of the local lan?

Firefox has both soft-fail and hard-fail modes.. for a soft fail it will fallback to traditional port 53 DNS. Its likely that will be the most common deployment - you need it to deal with captive portals (i.e. the hotel wifi) and other split horizon issues as well cloud uptime incidents. But there is a hard fail mode if that is suitable for your environment.

Re: Improving DNS Privacy in Firefox

#70
post #57
post #24

Why would I want my browser to do this? My browser should use the DNS configured by my OS -- in my case, a local, caching resolving NS. If I want to use some kind of DNS-over-HTTP I'll tell my OS to do it. I don't want my browser making DNS decisions for me. What am I missing?

I used this at some point on my Fedora laptop. I had issues on some hotel APs where it didn't allow me to see the 'login page' of the AP. What's the way to circumvent this problem? I'm frequently on public wifi's, so I need to access AP login pages without issue.

Trying to access any IP directly also typically works, e.g. 8.8.8.8. The redirect to that IP following the login is then of course broken/timing out, but that’s not really a problem.
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