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The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

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Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#61

Post by joejerryronnie »

almostdeadguy wrote: post #45
joejerryronnie wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are constantly getting turned down for dates, you are doing something wrong - probably approaching the wrong kind of people in the first place. Instead of looking for the super hot chick at the bar and then using cheesy pickup lines, why don't you seek out people who share your same interests, even if they don't seem like "your type". Most times you'll find their company vastly more enjoyable than the hot bar…

lmao buddy it probably has more to do with the "potential rapist" thing

Well, there is that.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#62

Post by dvtrn »

chillwaves wrote: post #50
dvtrn wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because of what it is inherently or bad actors soiling it for everyone else?

It's both. Inherently bad and bad actors promoting it in bad faith. PUA in a nutshell is lying to women, degrading them etc in a way to manipulate someone into a relationship. It is toxic to the core.

Interesting. This has me wondering about something:

I'm no incel or whatever, I'm also not particularly focused on a relationship (or sex, although there is a non-committed person in my life I see with regularity for both the casual romp and coffee dates to just sit and enjoy company), in married to the degree but I'm curious what you think: is there a difference between enjoying the art of playful flirting/courting and PUA? I'm someone who enjoys flirting and playful banter but have learned to have tempered expectations.

Part of me thinks that at the core, it's ALL an act of mind games to convince another person why you're worth their time (or conversely showing them why you're worth theirs) and there's going to be some level of duplicity involved. Be it "oh yeah I love sushi" (when you're really just passive about it) or "I drive a fancy car I can give you all the things" (when you're really leasing a slightly less than luxury sedan).

Just curious what your thoughts are

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#63

Post by _emacsomancer_ »

gardncl wrote: post #53
kartan wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (Not saying Social Security is bad in concept, but it only works in times of sharp population growth, and even then, banking on the youth to carry you just because seems squicky to many ). Social Security works with economic growth. It doesn't matter if you get 10 babies or 10 robots. Automation makes possible to keep proper living standards without exponential population growth. Social Security, as other services…

When social security was started 159 people payed into it per recipient. Nowadays it's about 3 people paying in for a single recipient. It's absolutely tied to population.

I assume the point is that if (for instance) 3 people today make the equivalent of 159 people in the past, then it still works out. (Whether or not that's true, I don't know.)

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#64

Post by heurist »

AIX2ESXI wrote: post #17
soontobemd55 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel this too. Most of my cis male friends won't date people that will make less money than them. I know I won't.

Yup. Most men will actually marry down economically, but women generally marry up economically. Perhaps when this is finally noticed, men will only marry their equals. With women graduating college at higher rates, perhaps this changes? https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/marrying-down-why-men-are-the...

My wife prefers a career working with autistic children, and earns much less than I do as a software developer because of that preference. She is amazing and I want to enable her to do whatever she is happiest doing using the money I am fortunate to be earning, as much as she is willing to let me help. You're looking at other human beings as merely economic objects and that's not going to net you happiness long-term. Consider each human you meet on the merits of their character, not their wallets...

This thread is ridiculous. Come back to earth, get out and meet real people.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#65

Post by ac29 »

gardncl wrote: post #53
kartan wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (Not saying Social Security is bad in concept, but it only works in times of sharp population growth, and even then, banking on the youth to carry you just because seems squicky to many ). Social Security works with economic growth. It doesn't matter if you get 10 babies or 10 robots. Automation makes possible to keep proper living standards without exponential population growth. Social Security, as other services…

When social security was started 159 people payed into it per recipient. Nowadays it's about 3 people paying in for a single recipient. It's absolutely tied to population.

That's a really disingenuous number, most people were not eligible for social security the first few years it was in place, so the worker:beneficiary ratio was very high. The ratio has been pretty stable for 50 years. Its about 3:1 now, it was about 3:1 in 1970 [0][1].

[0] https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/employed-persons

[1] https://www.ssa.gov/history/briefhistory3.html

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#66

Post by chillwaves »

dvtrn wrote: post #62
chillwaves wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's both. Inherently bad and bad actors promoting it in bad faith. PUA in a nutshell is lying to women, degrading them etc in a way to manipulate someone into a relationship. It is toxic to the core.

Interesting. This has me wondering about something: I'm no incel or whatever, I'm also not particularly focused on a relationship (or sex, although there is a non-committed person in my life I see with regularity for both the casual romp and coffee dates to just sit and enjoy company), in married to the degree but I'm curious what you think: is there a difference between enjoying the art of playful flirting/courting…

There is a way to do this without being toxic. If you are harming the other person, making them feel less so you feel more powerful, then it is a problem.

I am able to flirt with a woman without making them feel less so I don't know how to answer your question beyond that.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#67

Post by orangecat »

wvenable wrote: post #60
ryanx435 wrote: post #19

It's not economic. People have been poor for hundreds and thousands and millions of years, and yet they still had children.

Children used to be a source of labor and providing generational wealth. Now children are a source of financial cost, not benefit, and thus it doesn't make sense for poor people to have them.

it doesn't make sense for poor people to have them

I would speculate that the disincentive is larger for wealthier people. A lot of child-related expenses are for positional goods (house in a good school district, saving for college) where the price is basically "all your spare income". So if you're rich having kids means giving up awesome vacations and the option of retiring before 50; if you're poor those things were never on the table.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#68

Post by logicfiction »

alf-pogz wrote: post #29
8bitsrule wrote: post #6

Isn't just economic, methinks: Millennials also tend to be more perceptive about the costs of overpopulation and the approach of global warming. The wisdom of Small Is Beautiful is not so lost on them.

Speak for yourself. I'm petrified by the prospect of lack of growth. It is what our economy is built on, and a larger population could result in better science. There is plenty of land in the United States. Even our cities in the rust belt are underpopulated.

Land isn't the resource everyone is worried about though. Potable water, food, raw materials, survivable habits, etc.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#69

Post by Buldak »

justboxing wrote: post #32
kasey_junk wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anyone else was curious what SMV means in this comment it seems to be Sexual Market Value. It’s a term used amongst red pill/incel and such communities.

> red pill / incel incel = Involuntarily Celibate. What's red pill? Also, how does the 'Nu male' relates to, or is different from an incel dude?

My sense is that incels are red pilled and nu males aren't. So they might be similar in that they both fail to live up to a certain image of masculinity, but incels view that as a problem (or, at least, a hindrance) whereas nu males don't.

Re: The birthrate in the U.S. is the lowest it’s been in 30 years

#70

Post by throw_this_one »

AIX2ESXI wrote: post #22
throw_this_one wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think it through though. It's easy to follow the bandwagon of guys that purport that life to be the solution (I read all this stuff too), and I thought it was too at some point. I think you should go taste that lifestyle, but I think you'd find it to be only a short term fix and the same sort of "trap" awaiting you at the end. The solution to just simply arm yourself with all the knowledge you can, and then embark on…

Much appreciated man. Yeah, I have been doing the digital nomad lifestyle and lived abroad for a few weeks at a time for the past five years. I do see the trap that befalls most expats and am aware of risks. The months that I spend abroad are the happiest time of my life, when I come back to the states and can't get a date, am told I am toxic and a potential rapist and have to live in a city where homelessness is spi…

That's cool you tried it. I've done prolonged fast travel before, which is overrated. But staying in one spot for 1-3 months is something I think could be underrated and I want to try.

One trick I use sometimes is to imagine that I'm abroad even though I'm in my normal city. It makes things more interesting and gives me more energy for interactions.

The short and ethnic thing I could understand being frustrating. I'm basically 6' and white and pretty good looking. But even so, it's not the end all. It just opens the door. I don't get with the "cool" types of girls because I don't follow pop culture and play those games. Those types of girls you don't even want. It's tough though. Best way to meet girls is meetup-type stuff like a local running group, local language meetup, etc. Actually care about the activity and befriend the guys, etc. Then the benefits with girls come in a few months (take it slow and don't be the creepy/loser guy just there for girls). ex. I started going to the language meetup, and going hard in the languages and being kind of silly and fun. Now 2 years in, all the regulars know me and I have cred there. If I ever take a girl there, she knows I'm cool. Or new girls there know that I'm cool from the social proof.

If I didn't have a great family that I want to see monthly, I would definitely consider the moving overseas thing.

Basically you just focus on YOUR PATH and believe in what you spend YOUR TIME on. I think people get magnetized towards people with a "purpose" who can spread life energy instead of trying to take energy(this girl should give me love, this guy should give me respect or validation, etc).

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