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Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

theprovince.com

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Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#21

Post by orf »

john00088876 wrote: post #17
aldoushuxley001 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's true, the dairy farmers here in Canada act like an full fledged mafia

I don’t know enough about them to comment but situations like that is why trade agreements have tribunals and things go through the WTO etc etc. It’s a very complex balance with complex systems. Canada also imports more than four times the dairy than it exports: http://www.cdc-ccl.gc.ca/CDC/index-eng.php?id=3803 (poutine 2-3 times per day adds up I guess). Trump’s only direct authority for imposing steel tariffs is a…

> Unfortunately it takes a lot more effort to build things than tear them down

I think it will take many, many years to rebuild the positive reputation that the US had among it's allies. At least from the people I've interacted with there is a universal hate for Trump at a level that I have never seen before, across a wide cross section of society. The man is reprehensible.

It takes a while to get over that, and he will forever be there. Also if he is the new normal then God help us all.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#22

Post by sonnyblarney »

simonebrunozzi wrote: post #12
sonnyblarney wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite. When 2 nations are each protective, it's bad for both. If they are both open, it's generally good for both. But - if one protects in a sneaky way, and the other is open - the it's amazing for the protectionist country. So nations strive to be 'open' but then to sneak in stuff, or rather, sometimes they are open, but really are not. It's impossible for American companies to sell into Japan for many reasons,…

And the US Dollar is NOT a 100% politically controlled currency, in your view?

It would be wild to claim that USD is a politically controlled currency, to the point of conspiratorial, and the onus would be on you to provide proof that Trump et. al. are controlling interest rates or Fed programs. He most definitely is not.

There is no direct link between the executive/legislative and the Fed.

The Fed does what's roughly best for American economy, which disproportionately favours those with assets, banks etc. - but they are fairly independent in normal times.

In times of crises, you could start to point to some things like all those homes right now sitting on the Fed balance sheet, surely. But regular operations are not politically controlled.

But in China, the currency is literally worth whatever the government wants it to be at any time. They can literally press a button and 'poof'.

Because of the amazing control and power of the Chinese government, the RMB might be the most tightly politically controlled currency in all of history: at least all of the fiat money that failed in the past ... leaders had to water it down or print money behind the scenes over time.

Not to say that's entirely bad - one could make the claim that 'it's better for China' to have this, there'd be some good points there. But in terms of 'free trade' it's not good.

In any event, the US does not have open trade with China really, so there's constant trade tensions, there probably always will be.

I don't thin anything I'm saying is controversial or new, it just might be new data for the folks here on HN who I find are generally more tech than finance oriented.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#23

Post by stevenwoo »

wwweston wrote: post #5

Opinion: Trade sanctions against America won’t work. Sanctioning Trump himself might. https://www.macleans.ca/opinion/trade-sanctions-against-amer...

Retaliatory trade sanctions have worked against America but it took almost a year for the reprecussions to bubble up and make the President change his mind after the 2002 steel tariffs were enacted by the Bush administration. The Trump specific sanctions do seem like a ripe target for a more immediate response this time.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#25

Post by [deleted] »

stevenwoo wrote: post #23
wwweston wrote: post #5

Opinion: Trade sanctions against America won’t work. Sanctioning Trump himself might. https://www.macleans.ca/opinion/trade-sanctions-against-amer...

Retaliatory trade sanctions have worked against America but it took almost a year for the reprecussions to bubble up and make the President change his mind after the 2002 steel tariffs were enacted by the Bush administration. The Trump specific sanctions do seem like a ripe target for a more immediate response this time.

[deleted]

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#26

Post by AlexCoventry »

maxerickson wrote: post #19
parvenu74 wrote: post #11

Can anyone point to an historical case study where protective tariffs resulted in a better economic or social outcome? I can’t help but recall the saying: “When goods don’t cross borders, soldiers soon will.” Not that I think the United States is going to war with Canada, but the (German-dominated) EU and China are less certain.

Why would Germany invade Canada? More seriously, I will be pretty surprised if this particular stupidity escalates to any kind of military action.

It probably won't directly escalate to military action, but the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act of 1930 did make it a lot easier for the Nazis to take power in 1932.

Edit: I'd be grateful for an explanation for why this might be getting downvoted.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#27

Post by s2g »

wwweston wrote: post #5

Opinion: Trade sanctions against America won’t work. Sanctioning Trump himself might. https://www.macleans.ca/opinion/trade-sanctions-against-amer...

That sounds a whole lot more like a national security issue than the tariffs.

Could also use tariffs to try and hit the states that voted for Trump the hardest.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#28

Post by mabbo »

huangc10 wrote: post #4

Even though this decision may potentially affect my TN status in the states and more importantly will result in negative consequences for both countries, I am 100% behind Trudeau on this.

If NAFTA talks don't work out, folks like you and me with our TNs are actually going to start worrying about how we're going to keep our jobs.

And here I thought Canada wasn't one of Trump's "shithole countries".

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#29

Post by dominotw »

parvenu74 wrote: post #11

Can anyone point to an historical case study where protective tariffs resulted in a better economic or social outcome? I can’t help but recall the saying: “When goods don’t cross borders, soldiers soon will.” Not that I think the United States is going to war with Canada, but the (German-dominated) EU and China are less certain.

Seems to be working for china.

Re: Canada hits back at 'punitive' U.S. tariffs in 'turning point' in relations

#30

Post by dominotw »

jonhendry18 wrote: post #10
rednerrus wrote: post #3

Can you imagine trying to negotiate with this administration?

The way to "negotiate" with the Trump administration involves contributing to the Trump businesses.

Is this true? Do you have an example?
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