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If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

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Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#61

Post by hrasyid »

tj-teej wrote: post #7

The "Opportunity index" is "determined by dividing the number of job openings listed on ZipRecruiter by the number of active job seekers in that area" This leads to Baltimore being #1 and San Francisco 17th. I think this is overly simplistic and not representative of "opportunity", I used to live near Baltimore, I wouldn't say it has more opportunity for Software Engineers than SF.

"Finally, it combined the real adjusted salary data with the opportunity data, giving double weight to the opportunity data."

How do you decide how to combine "adjusted salary data" and "opportunity data"? They aren't even in the same unit. I find that this is often the problem with these city rankings (not only this one, but also "quality of life" or "most expensive city" rankings). There is no universal way to weigh these factors, and your result highly depends on the particular weightages you assign, often arbitrarily.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#62

Post by s73v3r_ »

reificator wrote: post #49
s73v3r_ wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I've lived in much worse growing up, I assure you." Good for you. That doesn't answer the question of why you would choose to do that now when you don't have to.

> Good for you. Is that particularly helpful here in this discussion? > That doesn't answer the question of why you would choose to do that now when you don't have to. Nor does it answer the question of why that dichotomy is being presented as the only option. I presented what I found to be the median home price, a price unimaginable to the average SF resident. It's a comparison point to highlight the vast gulf betwe…

"Is that particularly helpful here in this discussion?"

It's as helpful as you saying that you've lived in worse conditions in the past.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#64

Post by kasey_junk »

tptacek wrote: post #57
merinowool wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The image of Chicago has been tainted lately especially by the news of everyday shootings. How safe there is in comparison to let's say typical large city in Mexico?

The image of Chicago has in that regard been tainted by innumeracy.

And a systematic attempt by the President & company to discredit a city that has nearly universally rejected his policies.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#65

Post by Redoubts »

frockington wrote: post #18
fortythirteen wrote: post #11

Anyone with industry knowledge can look at those median salary numbers and instantly tell that the data set is faulty.

They're cost of living adjusted, so 100k in SF is going to be 30k in other places

Sure but every city is under 100K, which makes me agree that something is seriously off -- adjustment or no.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#66

Post by smsm42 »

Hmm, I'm not sure I want to move to Baltimore or Detroit even if they have tons of "help wanted" ads published. Especially after reading something like this: https://www.baltimorebrew.com/2015/08/07/baltimore-surges-pa... Of course, it's from 2015, but has much changed in 3 years?

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#67

Post by rb2k_ »

Roritharr wrote: post #53
acchow wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're looking at "median". If you're a "median" engineer, I would not recommend SFBA.

That's a really interesting point. I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for ME, wherever on the bell curve I might be. Before I was 30 I became CTO of a great company here, i really wonder if I had made such a career anywhere else if I'd moved to somewhere with a more vibrant tech-scene where my specific skill combination isn't as rela…

> if living with a family simply costs so much more there.

Being from Germany myself, the additional salary in the Bay Area usually compensates for the higher cost of living unless you're fresh out of University.

At least that's what I've seen for Engineers that remain mostly technical in Germany. I don't exactly know what CTO salaries are like in Germany, but I'd assume it's usually less than 200k Euros. Most experienced Engineers in the Bay Area make easily more than that in total compensation (salary, bonus, RSUs).

Even if you have to pay another 100k a year for rent/... , chances are you'd still come out ahead. Plus the weather is great.

That being said, society is a lot different in Germany, so it's not just about money and job opportunities :)

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#68

Post by Joof »

liquidise wrote: post #16

The "Median Salary" figures are surprising to me for a number of reasons. To isolate Denver specifically (where i live, work and hire routinely) i do not know a single developer who is making Perhaps this figure is brought down from the sheer quantity of code school (Galvanize, Turing, General Assembly) grads we have in the city, but even then i find it hard to believe 50% of the se's in Denver are making south of $6…

Any guesses on that? I'm making a decent bit into 6 figures if benefits like stock is accounted for with one year of industry existence.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#69

Post by acchow »

rb2k_ wrote: post #67
Roritharr wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a really interesting point. I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for ME, wherever on the bell curve I might be. Before I was 30 I became CTO of a great company here, i really wonder if I had made such a career anywhere else if I'd moved to somewhere with a more vibrant tech-scene where my specific skill combination isn't as rela…

> if living with a family simply costs so much more there. Being from Germany myself, the additional salary in the Bay Area usually compensates for the higher cost of living unless you're fresh out of University. At least that's what I've seen for Engineers that remain mostly technical in Germany. I don't exactly know what CTO salaries are like in Germany, but I'd assume it's usually less than 200k Euros. Most experi…

Yeah, I think for many engineers at the top companies they'd still come out way ahead even if they spent $100k more in rent. But realistically, rent is not that much higher. Maybe $20-40k more per year, depending on where you come from and how big your place (and family) is.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#70

Post by rb2k_ »

acchow wrote: post #69
rb2k_ wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if living with a family simply costs so much more there. Being from Germany myself, the additional salary in the Bay Area usually compensates for the higher cost of living unless you're fresh out of University. At least that's what I've seen for Engineers that remain mostly technical in Germany. I don't exactly know what CTO salaries are like in Germany, but I'd assume it's usually less than 200k Euros. Most experi…

Yeah, I think for many engineers at the top companies they'd still come out way ahead even if they spent $100k more in rent. But realistically, rent is not that much higher. Maybe $20-40k more per year, depending on where you come from and how big your place (and family) is.

Yeah, the 100k number was supposed to be rent and other things (food, child care, ...)
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