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I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

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Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#261

Post by mnm1 »

jexah wrote: post #258
mnm1 wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a proper healthcare system, for-profit insurance companies are not an essential part of the system. No one here is talking about Obamacare, btw.

I've yet to see a "proper healthcare system" that doesn't require private insurance. Take Australia for instance, where the healthcare system seems to work pretty well, but only because private insurance options are available. Without private insurance, the public system that is already slow would basically come to a stop, and those that can comfortably afford regular payments for private insurance (most people) that…

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fought against a few years back. I can only conclude that the people who elect these politicians are so hateful, they'd rather children and others die than spend money on their healthcare. That's some incredible fucking hate.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#262

Post by AnimalMuppet »

mnm1 wrote: post #261
jexah wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've yet to see a "proper healthcare system" that doesn't require private insurance. Take Australia for instance, where the healthcare system seems to work pretty well, but only because private insurance options are available. Without private insurance, the public system that is already slow would basically come to a stop, and those that can comfortably afford regular payments for private insurance (most people) that…

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fou…

You might try a little empathy. You have it for those with poor health and bad or nor insurance; you might try having some for those who disagree with you.

You might try to see how some of them might (reasonably) feel that the individual mandate was removing choice from them, rather than adding it. You might try to see how some of them felt that the cost of the mandated insurance was breaking them financially. Then you might not be so quick to ascribe their motives to nothing but hate.

You could have that level of empathy and still disagree with them.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#263

Post by conanbatt »

mynameisvlad wrote: post #254
conanbatt wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work in healthcare, I assure you you dont know. Because it depends on the service you are going to provide, the time you have, the procedures you are going to do, and that is done during the visit, no before service. When a doctor has to file a claim with an insurance,he has to pick between 10s of thousands of codes and then out of different procedures, that have different values based on how much documentation is…

Please, tell that to my dental office that's been doing just that for over a year for me personally, and I'm sure many more years for everyone else going there. Plus, I'm not even in their network and they can somehow figure it out. The codes are standardized for different procedures. If you know that you're doing procedure X, Y and Z and are billing against provider A who you've already billed before, then you know…

Your frame of references (dentistry) is not letting you see reality.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#264

Post by jexah »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #262
mnm1 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fou…

You might try a little empathy. You have it for those with poor health and bad or nor insurance; you might try having some for those who disagree with you. You might try to see how some of them might (reasonably) feel that the individual mandate was removing choice from them, rather than adding it. You might try to see how some of them felt that the cost of the mandated insurance was breaking them financially. Then y…

It takes self-awareness to not get too carried away, and courage to say what you think is right. I know you didn't explicitly agree with me (or anybody for that matter), but the mindset that you conveyed is what we need more of on both sides of the spectrum -- all over the world. Just because somebody has an opinion on something that one disagrees with, does not mean that the opinion comes from a position of hate, bigotry, or intolerance. Kudos to you, sir.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#265

Post by jexah »

mnm1 wrote: post #261
jexah wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've yet to see a "proper healthcare system" that doesn't require private insurance. Take Australia for instance, where the healthcare system seems to work pretty well, but only because private insurance options are available. Without private insurance, the public system that is already slow would basically come to a stop, and those that can comfortably afford regular payments for private insurance (most people) that…

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fou…

If I came from a family that had generated a significant amount of wealth (my family was low-middle class), and I had never used the public health, education, transportation, or welfare systems, I would be pissed if the government started robbing me at gunpoint, to provide a service that, in all likelyhood, neither my family nor descendants would ever use.

You need to remember that healthcare and education taxes are literal robbery on the rich, who never have, and never will use those services.

I'm going to say something that is controversial, and I myself haven't decided is fact, so please don't interpret it that way. Most people who work hard and are smart, can get themselves out of the lower class, regardless of their start in life (assuming they are in a first world Western country).

For reference, I live in Australia and I pay a Medicare levy (public healthcare tax). I do not have private insurance and regularly use public healthcare services. Additionally, I have been on welfare in the past. I do not believe that public health care is a Bad Thing (c), but I believe that robbing from those that have never used the services is deeply immoral.

I am not arguing for or against public healthcare. This is a difficult problem to solve. Im just trying to tell you that the decisions and opinions are not necessarily hate fuelled. If you went outside and spoke to those who disagree with you, and listened, you would see that there are reasons besides hate, that people vote the way they do. If you can see my perspective and agree with what I've written in this comment (it's a hard problem, and I'm not arguing whether healthcare is bad or not), perhaps you would consider mailing your state rep about considering a healthcare plan that is only available to the lowest earning in society, and is funded by those who required the services in the past and have "made it". Perhaps something similar to an education loan in Australia (government pays for your education, you owe them the fee plus 30% (fixed, not annual interest), paid out of a fixed % of your salary whenever you earn more than a certain amount).

While this went through my head, I just thought about the idea of bank loans for medical expenses. Why is this not a thing? The person gets their healthcare (human life value) and then they pay the bank back over time, and don't have to rob other people (anti-theft value). I am absolutely sure that I'm not the first to come up with this idea, what down-sides does this have, such that it hasn't been considered as a viable solution?

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#266

Post by mnm1 »

jexah wrote: post #265
mnm1 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fou…

If I came from a family that had generated a significant amount of wealth (my family was low-middle class), and I had never used the public health, education, transportation, or welfare systems, I would be pissed if the government started robbing me at gunpoint, to provide a service that, in all likelyhood, neither my family nor descendants would ever use. You need to remember that healthcare and education taxes are…

Rich people don't use roads? What do they teleport nowadays? Rich people can't get sick? Serially? So when a rich person comes into the emergency room and the treatment costs ten million dollars but they only have coverage for five is it ok to let them die? By your reasoning it seems to be a dilemma. Rich people don't go to schools either? A ton of public school enrollment records beg to disagree. Anyway, rich people are generally not the majority that's voting against healthcare. People who are literally one job loss, accident, or injury away from homelessness outnumber them greatly (aka pretty much everyone in the lower and middle classes in America). The perspective of the rich is clear: profit off of and exploit everyone else. The perspective of the non rich who are anti healthcare is not.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#267

Post by mnm1 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #262
mnm1 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every single healthcare bill proposed in Congress last year that was voted on was a bill to remove healthcare options from people. There wasn't a single bill proposing a government controlled healthcare system that would end the insane mess of profiting off other people's misery and death. There was even disagreement on extending healthcare funding for children through CHIP. Even the measly Medicaid expansion was fou…

You might try a little empathy. You have it for those with poor health and bad or nor insurance; you might try having some for those who disagree with you. You might try to see how some of them might (reasonably) feel that the individual mandate was removing choice from them, rather than adding it. You might try to see how some of them felt that the cost of the mandated insurance was breaking them financially. Then y…

How do you justify opposing Medicaid expansion or the children's health program (CHIP)? Cuts to Medicare? It seems to me that people who vote and sue against such things think that children, the elderly, and the poor don't deserve healthcare because not only do they vote against these programs and sue to stop them, they have no alternate proposals. Just let people suffer and die is their only proposal. You want me to empathise with people whose decisions will lead to the unnecessary suffering and death of millions? When they bring something, anything, to the table that doesn't increase suffering and death so more money can go to the rich, then we can talk. If they don't like the individual mandate, they should propose a different system that's does more than just leave people uninsured to suffer and die. Maybe then they might deserve some empathy but as long as they are actively fighting to prevent others from receiving healthcare, they deserve none.

Re: I wrote a negative Yelp review and it made my life a nightmare

#268

Post by jexah »

mnm1 wrote: post #266
jexah wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I came from a family that had generated a significant amount of wealth (my family was low-middle class), and I had never used the public health, education, transportation, or welfare systems, I would be pissed if the government started robbing me at gunpoint, to provide a service that, in all likelyhood, neither my family nor descendants would ever use. You need to remember that healthcare and education taxes are…

Rich people don't use roads? What do they teleport nowadays? Rich people can't get sick? Serially? So when a rich person comes into the emergency room and the treatment costs ten million dollars but they only have coverage for five is it ok to let them die? By your reasoning it seems to be a dilemma. Rich people don't go to schools either? A ton of public school enrollment records beg to disagree. Anyway, rich people…

I specifically avoided the example of roads, because, yes, everybody uses roads, and so everybody should be taxed to pay for them. My point was that people shouldn't have to pay for a service that they have never, and will never use. It is immoral to force somebody to buy a product or service against their will. Be it health insurance, education services, or whatever else.

By the way, I never said anybody should die. If you had actually read my comment, you would see at least one potential solution to the problem. If somebody with 5m gets sick and the medical bills cost 10m, then they could theoretically get a medical loan which they pay back over time. They might be paying it back for the rest of their life, but at least they're not dead.

I don't have statistics that indicate one way or another about the majority of people voting against public healthcare being those that need it the most. It doesn't really make sense to me, but I'm not arguing that point so I won't debate that.

I don't know what is considered middle class in America, but in Australia, 120k household income before tax is considered basically the bottom of the middle class. I could afford private health insurance in a single income family working as a cashier. So I would question the validity of the middle class being "People who are literally one job loss, accident, or injury away from homelessness".

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