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If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

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Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#51

Post by acchow »

reificator wrote: post #13
Areading314 wrote: post #4

I think many people would still rather make $55k in SF than $91k in detroit, even if these numbers weren't completely bogus

You're joking right? A quick googling shows the median price of a home in Detroit as $35k. I don't care how bad you are at budgeting, with $91k/y in Detroit you could buy two homes. I don't have to google San Francisco to tell you that you'd be lucky to afford to rent with three roommates on $55k in San Francisco. I get where you're coming from in terms of crime and such, but cost of living is a major part of choosin…

Money can't change the winters in Detroit

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#52

Post by merinowool »

tptacek wrote: post #12

This is bad. If your metric for best city for software engineers excludes from its top 10 not only SFBA but Seattle, New York, Austin, and Atlanta, your whole piece better be a prolonged and detailed explanation of how you concluded that metric was valid. I love Chicago and think we benefit in a lot of ways from running a tech company (mostly) from here, but there is no way Chicago is a better place to be a software…

The image of Chicago has been tainted lately especially by the news of everyday shootings. How safe there is in comparison to let's say typical large city in Mexico?

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#53

Post by Roritharr »

acchow wrote: post #50
tptacek wrote: post #12

This is bad. If your metric for best city for software engineers excludes from its top 10 not only SFBA but Seattle, New York, Austin, and Atlanta, your whole piece better be a prolonged and detailed explanation of how you concluded that metric was valid. I love Chicago and think we benefit in a lot of ways from running a tech company (mostly) from here, but there is no way Chicago is a better place to be a software…

They're looking at "median". If you're a "median" engineer, I would not recommend SFBA.

That's a really interesting point.

I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for ME, wherever on the bell curve I might be.

Before I was 30 I became CTO of a great company here, i really wonder if I had made such a career anywhere else if I'd moved to somewhere with a more vibrant tech-scene where my specific skill combination isn't as relatively uncommon as it is here.

Same with my lifestyle situation of being the working Dad in a one-income household. Doesn't matter that i'd be making a killing in SFBA if living with a family simply costs so much more there.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#54

Post by scarmig »

The link doesn't even try to answer what it claims it tries to answer.

If you're trying to maximize your income as a software engineer, you move to SF. If you're trying to maximize your standard of living as a software engineer, you move to Seattle. Adjustments for "opportunity index" only obfuscates that.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#55

Post by saryant »

indescions_2018 wrote: post #17

San Antonio is interesting. Have only visited. Enjoyed touristy bars on the Riverwalk. But its less than an hour from Austin. And I'm guessing even more affordable.

(I'm sure @mgirdley will show up here in a moment)

I used to live and work in San Antonio. Five years ago it was beginning to show signs of a tech scene. Geekdom had been around for a couple of years and acted as the hub of the community. TechStars had a program there (though no more).

I left four years ago for Boulder so I've been watching it grow at a distance. From what I see, deal flow has picked up and Houston Street in downtown has turned into the epicenter, anchored by Geekdom on one end and Codeup on the other.

It's a great place to live and I'm constantly tempted to move back, though I expect that I'd need to find remote work to maintain the pay I currently make up here in Colorado. Excellent food and low cost of living in a city that's rapidly growing up.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#56

Post by Fej »

scarmig wrote: post #54

The link doesn't even try to answer what it claims it tries to answer. If you're trying to maximize your income as a software engineer, you move to SF. If you're trying to maximize your standard of living as a software engineer, you move to Seattle. Adjustments for "opportunity index" only obfuscates that.

Why Seattle?

When I think Seattle I instantly think Amazon, which isn't particularly well-regarded around here from a work-life balance perspective.

The sheer number of Amazon employees would lower the average, correct?

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#57

Post by tptacek »

merinowool wrote: post #52
tptacek wrote: post #12

This is bad. If your metric for best city for software engineers excludes from its top 10 not only SFBA but Seattle, New York, Austin, and Atlanta, your whole piece better be a prolonged and detailed explanation of how you concluded that metric was valid. I love Chicago and think we benefit in a lot of ways from running a tech company (mostly) from here, but there is no way Chicago is a better place to be a software…

The image of Chicago has been tainted lately especially by the news of everyday shootings. How safe there is in comparison to let's say typical large city in Mexico?

The image of Chicago has in that regard been tainted by innumeracy.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#59

Post by scarmig »

Fej wrote: post #56
scarmig wrote: post #54

The link doesn't even try to answer what it claims it tries to answer. If you're trying to maximize your income as a software engineer, you move to SF. If you're trying to maximize your standard of living as a software engineer, you move to Seattle. Adjustments for "opportunity index" only obfuscates that.

Why Seattle? When I think Seattle I instantly think Amazon, which isn't particularly well-regarded around here from a work-life balance perspective. The sheer number of Amazon employees would lower the average, correct?

1) I'm also including cities like Redmond and Kirkland with Seattle.

2) Amazon's not a bad place to work: it only is thought so because of comparisons with other big companies. And even its negative aspects are as much team dependent as they are company dependent.

3) In general, working at a big tech company in Seattle will give you a small haircut in income while offering a far lower cost of living than SF/SV.

Re: If you’re a software engineer, where should you live to maximize your income?

#60

Post by acchow »

Roritharr wrote: post #53
acchow wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're looking at "median". If you're a "median" engineer, I would not recommend SFBA.

That's a really interesting point. I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for ME, wherever on the bell curve I might be. Before I was 30 I became CTO of a great company here, i really wonder if I had made such a career anywhere else if I'd moved to somewhere with a more vibrant tech-scene where my specific skill combination isn't as rela…

If you're happy, stop fantasizing about leaving :) You already have a family.

For younger people without responsibilities, I do suggest they think about the Bay Area. If you have the right set of skills, you can skyrocket your career rapidly. If you don't like it, move back home and hopefully you gained some valuable life experience.

I've seen staff engineers at age 25 at Facebook and Google... Very rare, but having this amount of impact, responsibility, and trust from others is basically unheard of anywhere else (outside of other major Google offices worldwide).

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