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Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

latimes.com

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Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#221

Post by foolfoolz »

admyral wrote: post #215
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame Elon Musk. I'm serious. He's been promising "self-driving" for years, except the damn technology isn't ready/safe enough for what people are clearly using this from. The manufacturer puts a warning label, but the usage model/UI is clearly flawed. His engineers know this, which is why Tesla's self-driving group has had such a high turnover rate over the last few years. Musk keeps overriding them.

No offense but this is exactly the attitude that inhibits progress and led the auto industry to languish in mediocrity for years. If you wait until the technology would prevent all accidents, you'd be waiting forever.

tell this to the families of the people who have died

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#222

Post by klenwell »

slavik81 wrote: post #204
userbinator wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From your link: The first car with Teetor's system was the 1958 Imperial (called "Auto-pilot") using a speed dial on the dashboard. More details here: http://www.imperialclub.com/Yr/1958/58AutoPilot/index.htm http://www.imperialclub.com/Articles/58AutoPilot/index.htm How ironic. I wonder how many drivers using that system crashed, thinking it would do everything for them...

Confusion over the function of cruise control was the subject of a long series of urban legends. I remember hearing at least one of these when I was growing up in the 90s. Ironically, the lesson of many of these stories is that the name for a fully self-driving system is "autopilot" not "cruise control". > [1995] This guy saves up his money and finally gets the van he always wanted. Fridge and tv in the back, all the…

And don't forget this famous example:

> [1996] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29ToNp1MY3c&t=33s

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#223

Post by firebones »

userbinator wrote: post #192
wpietri wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since circa 1968, "cruise control" has been used to refer to automatic throttle adjustment to maintain speed. [1] Is there some previous meaning that makes you think it misleading? Because I've never thought of it as meaning anything else. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise_control#History

From your link: The first car with Teetor's system was the 1958 Imperial (called "Auto-pilot") using a speed dial on the dashboard. More details here: http://www.imperialclub.com/Yr/1958/58AutoPilot/index.htm http://www.imperialclub.com/Articles/58AutoPilot/index.htm How ironic. I wonder how many drivers using that system crashed, thinking it would do everything for them...

This is a good example of a case where engineering from first principles, especially around user experience for driving, can lead to making the same mistakes again (e.g., autopilot naming, and potentially issues related to consistent braking performance found in the Consumer Reports review.)

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#224

Post by mymythisisthis »

When will the right mirror be replaced with a camera and dedicated screen. Until the 1980s cars didn't even have a mirror on the right side. Getting rid of the mirror will make cars more aerodynamic. It will also make cars safer, no more knocking over cyclists with the right side mirror. It will make cars cheaper to maintain, mirrors are expensive to maintain.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#225

Post by wooter »

foolfoolz wrote: post #221
admyral wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense but this is exactly the attitude that inhibits progress and led the auto industry to languish in mediocrity for years. If you wait until the technology would prevent all accidents, you'd be waiting forever.

tell this to the families of the people who have died

The NHTSA found a 40% crash rate reduction from Tesla's autopilot. So how about you tell all the people who lives have been saved that you wish they hadn't been because you're an emotional reactionary

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#226

Post by Someone1234 »

mentat wrote: post #172
confiscate wrote: post #91

I don't get it, why is it so hard to detect stationary objects in front of you? wouldn't that be the "hello world" of any self-driving tech? Every time I ask this question, the response is "radar as a technology has too much noise, not accurate enough to detect stationary objects". But it DOES detect stationary objects. Otherwise no one would even turn on Tesla AP at all. Why is it so hard to detect stationary object…

Subaru Eye Sight does this reliably and actually auto brakes correctly. Going from that to APv2 has been a real step back. There's a curve on 92W that it consistently try to accelerate you into an embankment. I think Elon just doesn't understand the real world reality of how bad AP is.

And Tesla's newer vehicles have the same sensors as Eye Sight, they just choose not to use them for Automatic Emergency Braking (AEB).

Tesla's fans always defend the failure of their AEB by pointing out flaws in radar, while entirely ignoring that Tesla's vehicles have contained front facing optical cameras for years now.

The Tesla shouldn't have hit the divider in the previous accident, the optical (visual light) camera should have seen it, even if radar didn't. Why doesn't Tesla's system work as well as Sabaru's Eye Sight?

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#227

Post by TeeWEE »

evrydayhustling wrote: post #114
eddieh wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/998988641702526977

Nothing about that thread suggests those are available while in autopilot, and they're not.

They are, you can see the driver demoing it here: https://youtu.be/1GrNv3ow9H8

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#228

Post by ams6110 »

mrgordon wrote: post #189
hfdgiutdryg wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're getting downvoted, but I agree. A commercial pilot doesn't flip on autopilot and start browsing the internet on a phone or take a nap. And that's at 30k feet where there's little traffic to worry about. It seems like a misunderstanding of what the technology does, by consumers and the media. I'm no expert on Tesla's marketing history, but I'm of the opinion that these crashes are due to drivers misunderstandin…

I don’t totally disagree with you but I will point out that planes land everyday in white out conditions with no visibility due to level 3 landing systems. The pilot can’t see anything and thus can’t help really even if they are awake. They’re mostly just there to talk to air traffic control for these kinds of landings. One pilot told me the Airbus planes no longer allow manual control.

Accoring to Wikipedia, you still need to have a minimum runway visibility unless you are landing CAT-IIIc, which is not used commercially (yet).

CAT-III landings are automatic, but the pilot needs some visibility to decide if the plane is going to touch down in the landing zone. If they are totally blind they will divert.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system#ILS_...

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#229

Post by carlivar »

RobLach wrote: post #42

I remember reading people saying that insurance premiums will plummet for Teslas because of how much safer they will be on the road. Today I read Tesla is getting into the insurance business because premiums are getting out of hand. It makes some sense since internally they’ll have more data they can use to deny claims. It’s interesting how reality plays out. https://electrek.co/2018/05/29/tesla-insuremytesla-insuran…

To be fair, a major reason they are expensive to insure is because parts and labor are in low supply and high demand, thus high repair costs.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#230

Post by TeeWEE »

eanzenberg wrote: post #76
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame Elon Musk. I'm serious. He's been promising "self-driving" for years, except the damn technology isn't ready/safe enough for what people are clearly using this from. The manufacturer puts a warning label, but the usage model/UI is clearly flawed. His engineers know this, which is why Tesla's self-driving group has had such a high turnover rate over the last few years. Musk keeps overriding them.

It’s pure arrogance. In the model 3 when you are in autopilot they have video games and memes to play/watch on the giant screen. How does this pass regulation and is allowed to be sold? Building products to actively distract an operator of a 2 ton vehicle moving 60 mph?

This is actually true. it baffled me too. For proof, check this review video by Top Gear. They demo the Easter eggs that are only available in AutoPilot mode; https://youtu.be/1GrNv3ow9H8
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