Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#211

Post by anonymfus » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:43 AM UTC

gehwartzen wrote: post #149

jfim wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the thing, how do you make an UI that unambiguously conveys that the car hasn't seen an object in front of it, so that the driver can react to it? Maybe with AR the car could highlight the objects detected so that the driver can brake if the car doesn't see an object it knows about, but a head mounted display seems pretty clunky.

The problem is that the "paying attention" part of driving is actually one of the most mentally taxing for the driver and it seems the pay attention 100% of the time is basically the same as saying 5% of the time an event might occurs that requires your immediate action. The problem being that if you have to jump into action to avoid something catastrophic 'sometimes' you basically have to be paying full attention al…

Japanese train drivers are famous for pointing at things to always keep attention. May be similar system can be used for cars: for example car could narrate objects it sees and ask driver to point at them with hand, then check with depth sensor and gesture recognition that user pointed correctly, and then slow down and stop if user pointed wrong.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#212

Post by Someone1234 » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:45 AM UTC

hndamien wrote: post #97

jonknee wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla sells a car that everyone from the sales people to the CEO says can drive itself, has a feature called Autopilot where the car drives itself and you're saying no one should be confused that the car can't drive itself... Regardless, the actual people who have gotten into an accident because of this should be proof enough that Tesla is misleading people.

Those accidents and these comments and downvotes are a greater proof that people like to mislead themselves. You must have missed the definition of autopilot in my comment.

I thought the car crashing into the parked police car, a parked fire engine, decapitated, and driving straight into a road divider at full speed were better proof that people are mislead by the term "autopilot."

Tesla likes to play both sides, it is "autopilot" when it works, but when it doesn't then the driver has literally under six seconds (according to Tesla) to avert a fatal accident.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#213

Post by kaitai » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:47 AM UTC

hndamien wrote: post #77

jonknee wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well then maybe they shouldn't call it auto pilot? I mean, how dumb of a name could they have chosen if they didn't want people to think the car can drive itself? They should also retrain their sales staff because on my test drive the saleswoman specifically told me the car could drive itself and that I should take my hands off the wheel to test it out. They should also retrain their CEO who keeps talking about "self…

Have full self driving hardware != full self driving software != full self driving capabilities. Auto pilot - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autopilot "An autopilot is a system used to control the trajectory of an aircraft without constant 'hands-on' control by a human operator being required. Autopilots do not replace human operators, but instead they assist them in controlling the aircraft. This allows them to focus…

It's great that you're willing to take a prescriptivist rather than descriptivist linguistic stance, but it's not that useful when it comes to consumer behavior.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#214

Post by joejerryronnie » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:47 AM UTC

TAForObvReasons wrote: post #167

dirkgently wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla's "Auto-pilot" is one of the most blatant market-speak lies I have come across lately, and they have been getting away it.

"Move fast and break things" is probably the worst philosophy to sweep over SV. It encourages a worldview where externalities that potentially break laws and maim or kill other people should be disregarded in the pursuit of "progress" and profits. But it's nice to see the HN community finally start to come to this realization

"Move fast and break things" was never meant for actual real world physical things (or laws). It was a mantra that encouraged breaking sacred cows and assumptions but has been bastardized and vilified by the anti-big tech crowd. Obviously you can be a little more lax on your production quality if you're building inane web apps rather than rocket ships or medical devices.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#215

Post by admyral » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:48 AM UTC

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #14

olliej wrote: post #6

I really wish all the car manufacturers would stop with this bullshit "you still have to be driving it" self driving nonsense. Claiming that the driver is still responsible for driving the car, while using a system designed to encourage the "driver" to not pay attention is a dumb idea, and all I can see is this kind of thing leading to regulations the delay actual self driving cars. I'm not a self-driving car fanboy…

Blame Elon Musk. I'm serious. He's been promising "self-driving" for years, except the damn technology isn't ready/safe enough for what people are clearly using this from. The manufacturer puts a warning label, but the usage model/UI is clearly flawed. His engineers know this, which is why Tesla's self-driving group has had such a high turnover rate over the last few years. Musk keeps overriding them.

No offense but this is exactly the attitude that inhibits progress and led the auto industry to languish in mediocrity for years. If you wait until the technology would prevent all accidents, you'd be waiting forever.

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#216

Post by api » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:50 AM UTC

admyral wrote: post #215

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame Elon Musk. I'm serious. He's been promising "self-driving" for years, except the damn technology isn't ready/safe enough for what people are clearly using this from. The manufacturer puts a warning label, but the usage model/UI is clearly flawed. His engineers know this, which is why Tesla's self-driving group has had such a high turnover rate over the last few years. Musk keeps overriding them.

No offense but this is exactly the attitude that inhibits progress and led the auto industry to languish in mediocrity for years. If you wait until the technology would prevent all accidents, you'd be waiting forever.

It needs to be as good as an average human. Do we have enough stats to compare yet?

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#217

Post by TeeWEE » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:50 AM UTC

"Unfortunately, our website is currently unavailable in most European countries. We are engaged on the issue and committed to looking at options that support our full range of digital offerings to the EU market. We continue to identify technical compliance solutions that will provide all readers with our award-winning journalism."

I can't read the article. Weird. is this because of GDPR?

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#218

Post by megy » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:50 AM UTC

confiscate wrote: post #91

I don't get it, why is it so hard to detect stationary objects in front of you? wouldn't that be the "hello world" of any self-driving tech? Every time I ask this question, the response is "radar as a technology has too much noise, not accurate enough to detect stationary objects". But it DOES detect stationary objects. Otherwise no one would even turn on Tesla AP at all. Why is it so hard to detect stationary object…

> I don't get it, why is it so hard to detect stationary objects in front of you?

This could only be said by someone who has never worked on the problem. I don't get it, why is programming so hard, you are just telling the computer exactly what to do?

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#219

Post by wooter » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:50 AM UTC

beamatronic wrote: post #180

dirkgently wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla's "Auto-pilot" is one of the most blatant market-speak lies I have come across lately, and they have been getting away it.

I feel like I-5 between SF and LA is probably one of the safer places to use it. Any place else, maybe not so much.

typical fear-based, anti-freedom, anti-progress response in these comments. The NHTSA found a 40% crash rate reduction from Tesla's autopilot. So yea "blame Elon Musk"

Re: Tesla in autopilot mode crashes into parked Laguna Beach police cruiser

#220

Post by mentat » Wed, May 30, 2018, 2:51 AM UTC

tgb wrote: post #202

mentat wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience says they're not with a few thousand miles of driving but sure, whatever.

How often are you attempting to drive into parked cars?

Cars in front of you decide to do random things like slam on the brakes or make sudden turns. Eye sight consistently would warn early then brake as much as necessary. I only had it do emergency braking 2 times and both would have been accidents as I'd misjudged the distance and speed of other objects. They have you test driving towards a trash can as part of the sale, it works, so not just cars in a lane. More interestingly though, the warnings, especially as early as they happen, made me a better driver fairly quickly. Tangentially, the warning sound on the Outback is far more compelling than on the Tesla. Weird UX thing.