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The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

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Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#51

Post by dwcnnnghm »

auntad wrote: post #2

I really like his example at the end - step-by-step deep dive into a specific topic. 30 hours of learning, direct links to resources, come out the other end as informed and aware of the topic at hand. I usually find it difficult to wade through the mountains of possible (often outdated) resources on a topic I'm unfamiliar with - At one point I was thinking it'd be useful to crowdsource those kind of step-by-step guid…

Some great suggestions here already but thought I would add Metacademy [0] and Learn Anything [1] (White Paper here [2]). These are designed to create a map of skills and concepts for a given topic. I find an interactive visualisation to be really effective in understanding the broader ideas before starting out or during the early stages when it’s hard to see how the pieces fit together.

[0] https://metacademy.org

[1] https://learn-anything.xyz

[2] https://github.com/learn-anything/learn-anything/wiki/White-...

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#52

Post by mlthoughts2018 »

blitmap wrote: post #43
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #14

One thing I cannot understand is why we have both: (a) a long history of research proving to us that principles like "High-Quality Work Produced = (Time Spent) x (Intensity of Focus)" are accurate and highly related to extracting the most economically valuable outputs from knowledge workers. (b) open plan offices. Maybe the tech industry is daunting for newcomers because we cram people into a sardine can, give them a…

I definitely learn things from people I don't expect to teach me anything. I'm used to pair programming being frustrating, but if you can put egos aside you pick up on different ways of thinking and way more exposure to life/programming experiences others have had. I think the shared office space is forced information exchange between people. It's not comfortable, it's not necessarily conducive to YOUR methods - but…

I actually am prevented from learning when I am forced to overhear exchanges between other teammates. Most of the exchanges are not relevant for me, often they are not discussing anything work-related as well.

It also swiss-cheese's my schedule, because instead of setting aside dedicated time for pair programming and for information exchanges or meetings, like you would think you should do in a professional workplace, those events are now thrust upon me even when I might be trying to finish some other work or I might have to urgently focus on something else.

The entire premise that continuous real-time audio is somehow synonymous with idea-sharing or collaboration is just insane.

Sincere collaboration is respectful of each individual's time and planned work schedule, as well as individual preferences for quiet, privacy, etc. Sincere collaboration can be asynchronous, textual, visual, or auditory (or a mix), can be remote-friendly, etc.

What you describe as "forced information exchange between people" is appropriate maybe for a trading floor or mission control, but the attempt to stylize a bullpen of software engineers in the same way is disaster, and at best it is superficial collaboration.

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#54

Post by dwcnnnghm »

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #14

One thing I cannot understand is why we have both: (a) a long history of research proving to us that principles like "High-Quality Work Produced = (Time Spent) x (Intensity of Focus)" are accurate and highly related to extracting the most economically valuable outputs from knowledge workers. (b) open plan offices. Maybe the tech industry is daunting for newcomers because we cram people into a sardine can, give them a…

The Cal Newport book on Deep Work that this article is based on has inspired a push for the Eudaimonia Machine [0] (an updated version by Newport himself here [1]). It’s a concept for an office that is designed to promote effective deep and shallow work. It’s a wonderful idea, though discussions on HN about it have pointed out that it’s difficult in startups, especially during high growth: allocating space for deep work (sound proofed rooms for individuals) takes up quite a bit of space that would be otherwise needed for a fast growing employee base.

[0] https://medium.com/@jsmathison/i-cant-stop-dreaming-of-eudai...

[1] http://calnewport.com/blog/2016/10/19/the-opposite-of-the-op...

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#55

Post by BeetleB »

jonathanfoster wrote: post #45

The author references Cal Newport's Deep Work [1]. I recently read this book and I can't recommend it enough. It's not just a productivity fluff piece about the importance of focus. He brings an academic rigor to the debate and backs up his claims with legitimate evidence. Best of all, the book is not just theory, it's 100% actionable. I used Newport's recommendations to reclaim 4+ solid hours of deep focus and it's…

>Block off each hour of the day and and fill it with one of the TODO items

Generally agree with the points but I'd like to note that this point is the most likely failure point in the method. Organizing the day by hours doesn't work for a lot of people. Most productivity books in the old days (60's) recommended it. They generally don't anymore due to the low success rate. That was one of the first things I tried as a student and it didn't work.

I find time and productivity management similar to dieting. It's not about which one is theoretically or objectively the best. It's about which method you personally can stick to. What works for one person will not for the next guy.

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#56

Post by the_seraphim »

taeric wrote: post #27
the_seraphim wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think what they are trying to convey is that mindless practice simply reinforces current skills. We've all been in that state of high performance where suddenly its 2am and you think "ok 5 more minutes" then its suddenly 4am. I would liken a lot of what he is saying there to a kind of trance state, similar to self hypnosis, where there is only the work in front of you. I get into this state most often when I sit do…

I get that they want to convey that. But prove it. There have been some studies into this, I am sure. Show some of the replications. (Specifically, do not show the initial studies.) Appeal to the times I've been focused for a time gets me to ignore all of the times I did the same and produced nothing . Not only produced nothing, but consumed nothing, as well. Both have happened. I do not keep a solid journal to say t…

Yeah, I get your point, and a lot of this is individual to the person... I personally know that when I am in the zone I perform better and remember the lessons learned for longer.

I would certainly be interested in more/followup studies regarding this matter.

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#57

Post by mlthoughts2018 »

dwcnnnghm wrote: post #54
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #14

One thing I cannot understand is why we have both: (a) a long history of research proving to us that principles like "High-Quality Work Produced = (Time Spent) x (Intensity of Focus)" are accurate and highly related to extracting the most economically valuable outputs from knowledge workers. (b) open plan offices. Maybe the tech industry is daunting for newcomers because we cram people into a sardine can, give them a…

The Cal Newport book on Deep Work that this article is based on has inspired a push for the Eudaimonia Machine [0] (an updated version by Newport himself here [1]). It’s a concept for an office that is designed to promote effective deep and shallow work. It’s a wonderful idea, though discussions on HN about it have pointed out that it’s difficult in startups, especially during high growth: allocating space for deep w…

Thank you for sharing. Some of these design ideas remind me a lot of the discussions in The Timeless Way of Building, particularly the hub-and-spoke idea compared with Christopher Alexander's passages about the importance of windows, with examples from Scandinavian designs that prioritize surface area of new buildings to give more people dedicated, personal windows (at least at the time of his writing).

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#58

Post by barftransit »

BeetleB wrote: post #55
jonathanfoster wrote: post #45

The author references Cal Newport's Deep Work [1]. I recently read this book and I can't recommend it enough. It's not just a productivity fluff piece about the importance of focus. He brings an academic rigor to the debate and backs up his claims with legitimate evidence. Best of all, the book is not just theory, it's 100% actionable. I used Newport's recommendations to reclaim 4+ solid hours of deep focus and it's…

>Block off each hour of the day and and fill it with one of the TODO items Generally agree with the points but I'd like to note that this point is the most likely failure point in the method. Organizing the day by hours doesn't work for a lot of people. Most productivity books in the old days (60's) recommended it. They generally don't anymore due to the low success rate. That was one of the first things I tried as a…

I can stick to eating candy and cake.

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#59

Post by bgilroy26 »

barftransit wrote: post #58
BeetleB wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Block off each hour of the day and and fill it with one of the TODO items Generally agree with the points but I'd like to note that this point is the most likely failure point in the method. Organizing the day by hours doesn't work for a lot of people. Most productivity books in the old days (60's) recommended it. They generally don't anymore due to the low success rate. That was one of the first things I tried as a…

I can stick to eating candy and cake.

For how long?

Re: The Importance of Deep Work and the 30-Hour Method for Learning a New Skill

#60

Post by mmt »

dwcnnnghm wrote: post #54
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #14

One thing I cannot understand is why we have both: (a) a long history of research proving to us that principles like "High-Quality Work Produced = (Time Spent) x (Intensity of Focus)" are accurate and highly related to extracting the most economically valuable outputs from knowledge workers. (b) open plan offices. Maybe the tech industry is daunting for newcomers because we cram people into a sardine can, give them a…

The Cal Newport book on Deep Work that this article is based on has inspired a push for the Eudaimonia Machine [0] (an updated version by Newport himself here [1]). It’s a concept for an office that is designed to promote effective deep and shallow work. It’s a wonderful idea, though discussions on HN about it have pointed out that it’s difficult in startups, especially during high growth: allocating space for deep w…

> space that would be otherwise needed for a fast growing employee base

I'm not sure what "otherwise" is supposed to mean here. Isn't the whole point of the "space" in the first place to enable the "employee base" to be more productive there than at home or remote?

Maybe that employee base wouldn't need to grow so fast if the existing employees could be more productive by, say, using existing space more effectively.

Lastly, it seems to be something of a cliche how hard and/or expensive it is for startups (especially, as you mention, when growing) to deal with space. I am, however, skeptical that the decision of having open plan offices is based on any kind of rigorous decision making rather than trend-following and following the path of least (initial) resistance.

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