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GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

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Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#141
post #47
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a list somewhere of what websites actually work without JavaScript enabled?

Sadly it's a shrinking list and as sites replace static content with things like React it's shrinking even faster. Good: HN works well and handles the downgrade gracefully (ex: upvoting becomes a POST rather than AJAX). Bad: The original Reddit site works ok but the new React based one one fails miserably as it shows a loading screen that never changes.

When old reddit goes away, there will still be this:

https://github.com/michael-lazar/rtv

I think there needs to be a movement to bring the WWW back to basic, readable, low-JS, animation-free, content-based sites.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#143
post #24
post #6

The day I added an ad blocker (Adblock Plus, Ghostery and uBlock origin) was the day my CPU fans stopped spinning almost constantly, my battery life improved, web pages loaded faster and were more responsive. My experience of the web is about a thousand times better than it used to be. I will remove all these when the ad companies and websites start to behave themselves, which will be never.

If you liked the effect of installing an adblocker give disabling Javascript a try. (You can selectively whitelist a small number of websites). Did this a couple of years back and the difference is astounding.

I'd be willing to bet your "small number" of white listed websites is actually a lot more than you think. Turning off Javascript breaks a ton of sites, IME.

Same thing with cookies.

On a side note, web developers have gotten really lazy at feature checking. In the IE days they'd at least have a banner saying their page wasn't going to work because it required IE or Netscape. Browsing with cookies turned off nowadays, I hit one or two sites a day that won't even display and then often get stuck in infinite redirect loop.

Even white listing sites to use cookies is a PITA. Outlook for Office65, for example, requires white listing cookies from 3 or 4 domains, and due to the way it redirects, I had to dig around in Chrome's page inspector to even find out what those domains are. And of course the page itself gives no indication of why it's not loading, it just flashes between empty pages forever.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#144
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Ghostery You surely aren't using it anymore, are you? They are now owned by an ad company.

I haven't signed up for an account or given them any data (and specifically made sure that I don't share usage or diagnostic data with them). They are a German company very much covered by GDPR, so I think it's relatively safe to use the tool this way. I'd be happy to hear otherwise though.

Yesterday Ghostery sent out a "Happy GDPR Day" email, which also leaked their users' email addresses in the CC field. I'd say they're off to a rocky start.

https://www.reddit.com/r/gdpr/comments/8m3t1s/ghostery_celeb...

https://www.reddit.com/r/Ghostery/comments/8m3nqq/did_ghoste...

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#145

How do you think free sites pay for producing all that valuable content? I find it astonishing that most people seem to think having access to news for free is almost a right. If you had taken their paid subscriptions they'd have served you a less add riddled version.

Ads are perfectly capable of being served without javascript and without cookies and without tracking users across the internet.

Serving ads requires exactly:

1) The HTML tag.

2) Server side rendering (at least enough to insert a URL into the src="" attribute of the tags.

3) A webserver that responds to the URL's inserted in #2 above by supplying an image.

That's it. And, in fact, in the beginning of ads on the internet, the above was how all ads were served. But sites didn't care for it much, because they had to do extra work to serve ads. And advertisers very much did not like it because they had to trust that their partner sites were truthful in their reporting of add impressions (for the pay by impression model).

And having the advertiser be the one running "the server" of #3 above (which would allow them to monitor impression counts) means that their partner sites need to be kept up to date with the latest set of active URL's, lest some tags show the broken link icon. Also a huge hassle.

The JS ad frameworks came about because the ad networks realized if they could lower the bar to gaining "ads" on a site, they could get more sites running ads (the push went something like "now use 'ad world 2.0', now just a single tag in your website, no other work on your part").

And along the way the ad networks realized that the companies purchasing the impressions were willing to pay more for impressions that might be more "significant", and "relevant ads" were invented. Of course, the unstated, behind the scenes, part of "relevant" was that in order to determine "relevance" we now have to track and monitor the end users activities all across the internet so that if we see J. Smith searching for cat food on Amazon, we can now start serving him ads on facebook for catfood, and they will be "relevant" because we know he is interested in cat food for some reason.

So sites don't have to go "ad free" to also be "track your users activities everywhere" free. They just have to return to the original model where the ad was the internet equivalent of a highway bill-board or a poster on the side of a bus-stop shelter. Untargeted, just there, maybe it is seen, maybe it is not.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#146
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn’t get any worse? The Internet is basically unusable today.

How long have you used the Internet with that opinion?

I’ve been using the Internet since the mid 1990s. It peaked around 1998-2002. It took me awhile to realize what crap it had become. These days, I stick to native apps for Maps, FB, mail, etc., plus websites that look like they’re out of the 1990s (e.g. HN, Westlaw, Google). To the extent I read the news, I get it from subscriptions on my iPad. (Mostly I just wait for my wife to fill me in based on pod casts she listens to.)

Every now and then I’ll wander into the regular Internet for something (e.g. HN links some article). Usually it’s a jarring and deeply unpleasant experience.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#147
post #6

The day I added an ad blocker (Adblock Plus, Ghostery and uBlock origin) was the day my CPU fans stopped spinning almost constantly, my battery life improved, web pages loaded faster and were more responsive. My experience of the web is about a thousand times better than it used to be. I will remove all these when the ad companies and websites start to behave themselves, which will be never.

Add a pihole into the mix and everything gets even better.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#148
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you liked the effect of installing an adblocker give disabling Javascript a try. (You can selectively whitelist a small number of websites). Did this a couple of years back and the difference is astounding.

I'd be willing to bet your "small number" of white listed websites is actually a lot more than you think. Turning off Javascript breaks a ton of sites, IME. Same thing with cookies. On a side note, web developers have gotten really lazy at feature checking. In the IE days they'd at least have a banner saying their page wasn't going to work because it required IE or Netscape. Browsing with cookies turned off nowadays,…

> I'd be willing to bet your "small number" of white listed websites is actually a lot more than you think. Turning off Javascript breaks a ton of sites, IME.

My experience is the opposite.

I used NoScript for almost 8 years, and then switched to uMatrix one year ago.

I don't need to enable JavaScript in most sites. And, if I need it, only enable some parts of the page. Most websites are much faster with this.

Re: GDPR Version of USA Today Is 500KB Instead of 5.2MB

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now we only need to find somebody to pay for that simple web....

I think there's somewhat of a false dilemma there. There are plenty of sites that I frequent that have tastefully located, static banner ads that are served directly through the site operator rather than through an add network. This has the dual advantage of allowing the operator some editorial control, and of producing ads that tend to be much higher quality (to me, anyway) because they involve actually telling me a…

I don't think it is a false dilemma. The problem is about the difference between the magnitude of revenue generated by the proposed methods. Both for publishers AND people interested in advertising products.

Tasteful banners are nice but tracking the performance of such ads is very hard. Ad business is really cut-throat. When you visit a site, there literally are multiple ad networks / advertisers bidding for a spot in front of you, with real money, based on the site, your location and your interests. A huge network of autonomous trader bots that trade real money billions of times per day for a spot in front of a human's eyeballs. If an algorithm decides that you have a higher than normal probability of converting to a paying customer, they (an AI or expert system) decides on the spot to pay "premium" to be in front of your eyeballs. They do this while running A/B tests with different ad variations to figure out what converts better, for which segment of the population etc.

Modern ads are not only kind of targeted. They are INSANELY targeted. There have been instances of people targeting singular people through ads based on geolocation and interests.

A publisher cannot be expected to run all that bidding code on their own servers. Those networks are actually a network of networks. If you are buying ads today, you want analytics immediately to see how you are doing, how much you are spending so that you can improve and adapt before sinking more money on it.

The profits generated by such methods are a couple orders of magnitude higher than a simple untrackable banner on a site placed by a site owner which gets swapped out whenever...

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