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GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

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Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#311

Post by jwalton »

riantogo wrote: post #281
sbuk wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can collect email addresses still, so long as you have a legitimate reason to, you seek consent, you store them securely and remove them if consent is withdrawn. These are things that you should be doing anyway! Even if it's an open source side project.

Sure. But let’s not pretend that it is cheap to do. All I’m saying that if you are cheering govt stepping into the equation then let’s have an honest discussion on who it hurts and who it benefits. Let’s take a stock of the impact to garage innovations. That is all.

Are you aware that it was illegal for you to collection email addresses from Canadians without their consent, due to [PIPEDA](https://www.priv.gc.ca/en/privacy-topics/privacy-laws-in-can...), long before the GDPR ever came into effect?

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#312

Post by paulddraper »

colonelxc wrote: post #280
ithkuil wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently you need to appoint a Data Protection Officier and you cannot just be e.g. CEO, developer and DPO at the same time. https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-the-general-da... > Basically this means the DPO cannot hold a position within your organisation that leads him or her to determine the purposes and the means of the processing of personal data Are there exemptions for very small companies? If you…

From the same site: """ Under the GDPR, you must appoint a DPO if: you are a public authority (except for courts acting in their judicial capacity); your core activities require large scale, regular and systematic monitoring of individuals (for example, online behaviour tracking); or your core activities consist of large scale processing of special categories of data or data relating to criminal convictions and offen…

> 'large scale' in terms of the GDPR.

I have no idea what that means. If my B2B business has a lot of revenue but few customers, am I 'large scale'? If my B2C business has little revenue but a lot of customers, am I 'large scale'? Or maybe 'large scale' applies to the number of servers I use? I have no idea the criteria.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#313

Post by lajhsdfkl »

tommorris wrote: post #302
lajhsdfkl wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I was thinking about getting in to the car market but all these pesky requirements that I sell a car with airbags and seatbelts and fuel efficiency compliance are just there to protect existing incumbents. I think by going to cars to prove your point proves how ridiculous regulation for websites are. For some reason there exists a group of people that believe that websites like facebook need regulations that are as…

My comparison is simply to show the standard laissez faire talking point of "oh, regulation exists just to protect incumbent market players" as bullshit: regulations exist to protect consumers from negligence and misbehaviour on the part of the companies. The fact you think GDPR only applies to websites rather than the huge clusterfuck of personal data loss means you haven't understood the reason behind GDPR. Equifax…

>My comparison is simply to show the standard laissez faire talking point of "oh, regulation exists just to protect incumbent market players" as bullshit: regulations exist to protect consumers from negligence and misbehaviour on the part of the companies.

We'll see. I have a feeling that European consumers and web companies are in for a world of hurt.

>The fact you think GDPR only applies to websites rather than the huge clusterfuck of personal data loss means you haven't understood the reason behind GDPR.

I know that GDPR applies to everyone, I think it's pretty obvious it will be selectively enforced since the regulation is too burdensome. Do you think your local mom and pop hair salon that is not in compliance will ever be fined?

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#314

Post by seszett »

rdlecler1 wrote: post #138

They claim that everyone had a lot of time, but what about the 1-3 person startup that’s been around for 4-5 years who is just getting by and didn’t have the resources to re-engineer their entire application or to write up a complex privacy policy or hire an EU Representative (Yes, apparently that is required as well). If the EU does clamp down on forced consent I think the long tail of small startups and publication…

> hire an EU Representative (Yes, apparently that is required as well)

Only for large-scale behaviour tracking operations. It's quite unlikely that this applies to a 1-3 person startup.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#315

Post by lajhsdfkl »

imdutch wrote: post #19
firic wrote: post #10

Things like this will test how much EU citizens value their privacy. Of course there will be some sites they will not be able to visit but time will show if they are okay with that. These rules are very similar to rules limiting loans. No matter how desperate a person is and how low credit they have, in the US you can't give them a loan for above a certain amount of interest. That could be terrible for a poor person…

You can still run a free website and be compliant with the GDPR. The EU/EEA is the largest market in the world, closing yourself for an market that size will hurt more than changing a few thing to be compliant.

> The EU/EEA is the largest market in the world

Please don't believe your own propaganda. EU/EEA revenue is a fraction of US revenue for all large multinationals. Small businesses probably make even less from the EU.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#316

Post by paulddraper »

lajhsdfkl wrote: post #301
monkeynotes wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> VW haven't even been fined for cheating on their emissions test. Exec has been fined and sentenced to 7 years[0] VW have been fined $2.8B[1] [0] https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/12/judge-sentences-... [1] https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/judge-approves-larges...

By the US and 2.8B is a fraction of what they deserved to be fined. All VW execs should be in prison for the rest of their lives for what they have done.

> All VW execs should be in prison for the rest of their lives for what they have done.

You must point to the laws violated. E.g. Schmidt made a false statement to the California Air Resources Board under the Clean Air Act.

Trial in the court of opinion and mob lynching is not compatible with the Western tenements of law.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#317

Post by str33t_punk »

tommorris wrote: post #230
rdlecler1 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regulations tend to favor incumbents, decreasing competition, and thereby increase monopoly and creating central hubs of systemic risk. There is no free lunch with one-size-fits-all rule making. Unfortunately regulators think there is.

I was thinking about getting in to the car market but all these pesky requirements that I sell a car with airbags and seatbelts and fuel efficiency compliance are just there to protect existing incumbents.

Ones related to safety. The other ones related to a nebulous concept of data privacy

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#318

Post by lima »

lajhsdfkl wrote: post #310
lima wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> hire an EU Representative It's called Data Protection Officer and you only need to appoint one if processing personal data is your core business, which is reasonable. https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-the-general-da... And yes, I expect the EU to enforce the consent rules. It's very central to the GDPR.

>It's called Data Protection Officer and you only need to appoint one if processing personal data is your core business, which is reasonable. Not commenting on the validity of this statement but it's interesting how I can tell from which continent you are from just by you saying that the regulation forcing a business to hire DPO is reasonable.

Yes, I'm from Europe, and it's my opinion that the GDPR is very necessary and mostly reasonable.

I say that even though it caused me a lot of work for the past months.

The requirement to hire a DPO is not a new thing, by the way - many countries in the EU already required this. This is true for many provisions in the GDPR - in Germany, for example, very little changes from the way it used to be, their data protection law was strict to begin with.

The big difference is that companies would just ignore the laws in, say, Germany since they were operating from Ireland, and would claim that the German courts had no jurisdiction. Now, it's the same everywhere in Europe, which makes it much easier to enforce.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#319

Post by lajhsdfkl »

voidr wrote: post #257
rdlecler1 wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You assume that just because someone doesn’t want to got through all the hassle of being GDPR compliant that the website is somehow bad? Among other things this includes setting up an EU represeneitive—a high bar for a free product..... Obviously you haven’t had to deal with GDPR compliance.

> You assume that just because someone doesn’t want to got through all the hassle of being GDPR compliant that the website is somehow bad? If they are not collecting any personal data, there is no hassle. Do you think it's somehow bad for a car manufacturer to not want to go through the hassle of making their cars conform to the safety standards? > Among other things this includes setting up an EU represeneitive Cita…

>Obviously from what? Are you a GDPR compliance expert?

You don't need to be a GDPR compliance expert to know that the costs of implementing GDPR are huge and I doubt any GDPR experts actually even exist today.

Re: GDPR: US news sites unavailable to EU users over data protection rules

#320

Post by maushu »

oldcynic wrote: post #215
sireat wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That looks fantastic, I would actually read USA Today if this lean site sticks around. If they want to monetize, publishers should control their own generic ad inventory (like they used to in old pre internet days) and ask for opt-in if you want customization. Easy on paper but hard in reality.

"This site does not collect personally identifiable information or persistent identifiers from, deliver a personalized experience to, or otherwise track or monitor persons reasonably identified as visiting our Site from the European Union. We do identify EU internet protocol (IP) addresses for the purpose of determining whether to direct you to USA TODAY NETWORK’s EU Experience. This site provides news and informatio…

I was surprised when my adblocker didn't bleep once. This is like looking what the internet could be. It could've been great.
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