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The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

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Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#111

Post by CaptainZapp »

kumarvvr wrote: post #93

Recently went to Japan. For a 'order' freak like me, it was heaven on earth. Not only in train stations, each and every aspect of their lives revolves around understanding human behavior and coming up with solutions to make activities as less confusing as possible. Their commitment to discipline is astounding. If everyone on earth were like the Japanese, our pace of technological, social and other forms of developmen…

What I actually liked most is the following:

Eating fermented fish out of a bento box, while gliding through Japan with 300km/h is completely acceptable, yacking away on your cell phone is not.

It makes for a very pleasent (and delicious) atmosphere while using public transport.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#112

Post by SmellyGeekBoy »

fiblye wrote: post #55
t413 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those 'ultrasonic deterrents' should be completely illegal to deploy on/near any publicly accessible property. Having run into them many times over the years here in the US they're horrifically loud, painful, and less of a deterrent and more a punishment for having less-degraded hearing.

Agreed. I'm well beyond being a teenager, but I still hear these things. Some stores put them near their entrances and it's never a pleasant surprise.

Indeed. I'm 34 and can still hear them.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#113

Post by mayankkaizen »

dorfsmay wrote: post #67
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #40

In my first experience with trains in Japan, I had to take a jaunt that included a leg from Nagoya to Matsusaka. The train ride was about 90 minutes, and I was anxious about knowing which station to exit. I anticipated that the signage would all be in Japanese. So I asked the station attendant in Nagoya how I'd know when to get off. He looked at my ticket and said, "The train will stop at 1:11PM. You get off." The tr…

I don't understand, isn't that how trains work everywhere? Otherwise how are the people in the next city supposed to know when they need to be there to board that train?

In India, this is not how it works usually.

I mean if a train is late by 5-30 minutes, the train is said to be on time.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#114

Post by CaptainZapp »

MarkSweep wrote: post #73
kalleboo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm visiting London right now, and compared to here, Tokyo train stations are amazing for signage. There are always super clear, easy to spot signage for where transfers & exits are, what exits they are and what landmarks they lead to, where elevators or escalators are, etc. Electric signs starting at the entrances (before the gates even) for what trains are arriving at what platforms and when. In London navigational…

The multitude of train companies is further complicated that some companies have through service on each other tracks. Do you will be waiting on a Toei Asakusa Line plateform when a train from the KeiKyuu company shows up. The map inside the train does not have the station you just departed from on it much lest your destination. Good luck! I enjoy figuring out how their system works so it does not bother me. But I te…

I think the navigation system, which is company independent, is fantastic.

For those that have never been to Japan and using Tokyo Metro as an example:

Every metro line has a name and a color. For example: The Asakusa line (A) has a reddish color. The A designation is only used by the Asakusa line and each station has a number.

Higashi-Ginza is A11. It's also H09, because it's also a station for the (gray) Hybia line.

The system is extended to other operators. All Yamanote line stations are JYn, where n signifies the station number.

That (and a Pasmo or Suica smart card, which lets you switch systems seemlessly) makes navigation, even in the Tokyo transit system, which is arguably the most complex in the world, very easy and intuitive.

The same system is applied in every other Japanese city I've visted, alas the system is usually much simpler.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#115

Post by wavegeek »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #82
BigJono wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Melbourne at least it seems like the system is run exactly at capacity. If one train has to stop at a platform for 3 minutes extra because of a signal fault or a sick passenger, every train on that line (and probably 2 other lines) for the next 3 hours is critically fucked. It seems like there's no leeway in the timetables to make up lost time, and no extra trains parked in the outer suburbs (morning) or CBD (afte…

The other day my train had to wait for 5 minutes just outside Flinders St station because didn't have a platform to park the train at. Flinders is a real bottleneck, if the flow starts to stutter there, everything falls to bits. Upon saying that, Melbourne's trains are usually pretty good, over 90% on time. It's the buses here that I have issues with. The timetable at the stop is completely useless, and the app is no…

> over 90% on time

While true, this is a factoid.

1. Some trains never run. For the commuter this is like a very late train. You need to add the "did not run" numbers to the late trains to get a total effective lateness figure.

2. Some trains run but are so full you cannot get on them. Try catching a train from Prahran to the city at 8am. Nonetheless, this counts as an on time service.

3.On time is defined as anywhere from 1 minute early to 5:59 late. To me six minutes late is not on time.

4. The fraction of late trains is much higher in peak hour, when more people are affected. So the effective late % is higher than it looks at face value.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#116

Post by skjerns »

11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #40

In my first experience with trains in Japan, I had to take a jaunt that included a leg from Nagoya to Matsusaka. The train ride was about 90 minutes, and I was anxious about knowing which station to exit. I anticipated that the signage would all be in Japanese. So I asked the station attendant in Nagoya how I'd know when to get off. He looked at my ticket and said, "The train will stop at 1:11PM. You get off." The tr…

Nowadays most stations are also subtitled in Latin writing

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#117

Post by CaptainZapp »

mikekchar wrote: post #59
nlawalker wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just another anecdote alongside the others. Maybe I got lucky but I found the amount of written and spoken English in Japan, especially in the metropolitan areas, to be perfectly adequate. As for actually getting around, it's just a matter of having the right tools. I'm mostly sharing this for the benefit of anyone thinking of going to Japan. - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are s…

> The Japan Rail Pass, while not having any functional use, did make things cheaper Just a quick comment for anyone planning to come to Japan. If you are going to stay in Tokyo, then the Japan Rail Pass is probably not worth it (it only gives you a free pass on JR rail). But if you are going anywhere else , you absolutely should get this. Especially on the Shinkansen, you get free reserved seat tickets. Also, the sys…

Absolutely that!

Another example: Travelling from Tokyo to Sapporo return (the part from Hakodate to Sapporo is not covered by Shinkansen, but should be from 2030, but I digress) is more expensive than a three week train pass.

If you're not strapped for cash get a pass for the green car (first class). The price difference is minimal (ca. 60K Yen vs. 80K Yen for three weeks) and it makes travelling even more amazing.

I'd say my savings where > 2K $ last time in Japan with the rail pass.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#118

Post by sjmulder »

t413 wrote: post #50
lainga wrote: post #2

>Rail stations, whether in Japan or elsewhere, are also great places to see “nudge theory” at work. Gentle nudges, like ultrasonic deterrents to keep teenagers away with "a look of confusion or discomfort, and often a cry of urusai! (Loud!)"...?

Those 'ultrasonic deterrents' should be completely illegal to deploy on/near any publicly accessible property. Having run into them many times over the years here in the US they're horrifically loud, painful, and less of a deterrent and more a punishment for having less-degraded hearing.

Completely agreed. There's this road I sometimes have in my running route where one of the residents there put one of these things in their front yard. It hurts my ears and, I'm afraid, my longer term hearing if it happens often enough. It's really loud.

Who'd think it okay to inflict this sort of thing on people of _any_ age? It's also a blatant attempt at age discrimination.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#119

Post by zeeZ »

twblalock wrote: post #36
nlawalker wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just another anecdote alongside the others. Maybe I got lucky but I found the amount of written and spoken English in Japan, especially in the metropolitan areas, to be perfectly adequate. As for actually getting around, it's just a matter of having the right tools. I'm mostly sharing this for the benefit of anyone thinking of going to Japan. - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are s…

> - The landscape of transit cards is confusing, and while many of them are still accepted in various places, the existence of such a wide variety is mostly a legacy thing as far as I could tell. I had a Suica card and it worked virtually everywhere I went in Japan, though I didn't venture off the beaten path. I think this is correct. I first went to Japan in 2008, and the cards you had actually mattered. I went agai…

You got close there. Suica (and the Icoca I have, don't know about others) are valid for 10 years after last use. This seems like a ridiculously huge amount of time to me.

Re: The Psychology of Japanese Train Stations

#120

Post by [deleted] »

pwaivers wrote: post #14
tbabb wrote: post #11

> Operating on the theory that exposure to blue light has a calming effect on one’s mood, rail stations installed these LED panels as a suicide-prevention measure Color me completely skeptical. That sounds like superstition to me. It reports that rates declined after installation, but if they preferentially installed the lights in areas with high rates of suicide, then we should expect to see https://en.wikipedia.org…

It said that the lights led to a 84 percent decline in suicides attempts. That may not be true, but it is definitely way higher than "regression towards the mean" would cause.

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