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Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

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Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#231

Post by zerostar07 »

jdietrich wrote: post #229
zerostar07 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> huge competitive advantage I get the advantage of being more prepared to apply GDPR but that lasts 1-2 months max. The fact that people keep using facebook mindlessly in and out of EU over the last year makes one wonder: Does it really matter to users?

>I get the advantage of being more prepared to apply GDPR but that lasts 1-2 months max. The advantage is in having a sustainable business model that isn't based on exploiting user data. With GDPR-compliant privacy controls in place, it'll be a lot harder to target advertising or profit from user data by selling it to third parties. Companies that provide a "free" service based on these revenue streams will face a lo…

> The advantage is in having a sustainable business model that isn't based on exploiting user data.

facebook can do that too (it's just less profitable), so there isnt really an advantage here.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#232

Post by NicoJuicy »

kodablah wrote: post #222
Roritharr wrote: post #86

What struck me as quite interesting was Guy Verhofstadts sideremarks. >"You have to ask yourself how you will be remembered," he said. "As one of the three big internet giants together with Steve Jobs and Bill Gates, who have enriched our world and our societies, or on the other hand, the genius that created a digital monster that is destroying our democracies and societies." I imagine you have to talk like this to a…

> "destroying our democracy and societies" Imagine how you have to talk to a doomsayer like that knowing no matter what you say, there will be no chance to get through to him.

Depends, he's not wrong if facebook is used as a propaganda device

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#233

Post by PeterisP »

sparkling wrote: post #71
thebradbain wrote: post #55

If worst comes to worst and EU tries to break up Facebook — and it seems likely they might — what would be Facebook’s best path forward? Theoretically, would it send a stronger signal to US regulators if Facebook simply shut down all operation in the EU? A pop up message to all EU citizens along the lines of “You may no longer access Facebook from within the EU due to X Y and Z from your government. As such, all of y…

Shut down the EU company entities, move all operations back to the US. There is no need to show a warning message to its users, EU laws do not apply to US firms. Also, despite what EU lawmakers may say, a purely US-based internet company is not required to comply in any way with EU laws even if they have customers/visitors/users in the EU.

Around 25% of Facebook's worldwide revenue comes from EU.

Taking your ball and going home means leaving a lot of money on the table.

A purely US-based internet company is required to fully comply with EU laws if they want to see a single (euro)cent from customers in EU, otherwise all that money can and will be seized.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#234

Post by collyw »

sparkling wrote: post #154
Dumbdo wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it seems like this guy doesn't even know how the EU works. If you reduce it to "they regulate cucumbers but don't care about real threats" you probably fell for some cheap propaganda but it doesn't speak for your understanding of EU regulations.

Its not FUD, its not a myth, its not cheap propaganda, its real: Commission Regulation (EEC) No 1677/88 of 15 June 1988 laying down quality standards for cucumbers [1] Yes i know this regulation is no longer in place, thats not the point. The point is that the EU is a overblown bureaucracy that should not be in charge of regulating every silly little aspect of life across the various member states. And yes, they are…

I am quite happy with a number of the "bureaucratic rules" they produce, such as allowing the ban on roaming changes between EU countries and net neutrality for example.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#235

Post by bryanrasmussen »

Tharkun wrote: post #18
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're not allowed to say usage of an application/service is conditional on accepting data collection.

I still don't see why not. Maybe it's what GDPR says, but it's wrong and I can't see this being enforced. If data collection is the "payment" for using the "service", you have two choices: you don't pay and don't use the service, or you pay up. This is like saying a business can't make usage of a service conditional to payment.

If privacy is a right it might be that in some legal systems you are not allowed to give up your rights, at least not in perpetuity.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#236

Post by wastedhours »

sparkling wrote: post #167
gerhams wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sound like you don't own a passport and just repeat fearmongering you hear on the news Please get a passport, visit Europe, and then have an informed opinion. I can't speak personally for the eastern or southern states but here in central europe things are quite peachy. The central/west/northern parts of Europe are the most stable in the world, I doubt that will change soon, regardless of what happens elsewhere.…

Thank you for your concern: i have a passport and i have visited every EU member state with the exception of Romania and Sweden.

On a more positive note that the rest of the thread: having been to both, I'd highly recommend them, and if you want any recs, let me know!

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#237

Post by mikejb »

sparkling wrote: post #209
wierd0 wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you are doing in this thread is the definition of spreading fear, uncertainty and doubt around the institution called "EU". I'm personally not against you doing just that. I'm just against you trying to call it something else. Boiling down what you have actually said in this thread I'm left with "but the EU spends money on things that _I_ wouldn't have". Is that the gist of what you are trying to convey here? Or…

Voicing a opinion is not spread fear. Jesus, sometimes HN is worse than 1984.

Voicing an opinion that announces the downfall of a large collective of states is spreading fear though. Maybe you're right and we're heading into a scary future, but it doesn't change that expressing that opinion is spreading fear.

Don't get me wrong, you have the right to express that opinion - but everyone has the right to form an opinion about you based on it.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#238

Post by phicoh »

rndgermandude wrote: post #228
zerostar07 wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> least in Germany Germany is draconian about privacy , but a lot of the rest of the EU is really not. I would even expect a backlash to GDPR from businesses or politicians or people who lose access to audiences.

Draconian? Just because we got laws in Germany saying you need permission to store personal data and you need to make available that data upon request and/or remove it upon request?

One thing I always found rather bizar is where ISPs break internet connections after 24 hours to force the customer to get a new IP address.

And then the next step was where the home routers would disconnect after less then 24 hours to make sure that the disruption happens in the middle of the night. Or something to that effect.

I wonder if in Germany people get new telephone numbers every 24 hours as well.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#239

Post by devit »

phicoh wrote: post #69
thebradbain wrote: post #55

If worst comes to worst and EU tries to break up Facebook — and it seems likely they might — what would be Facebook’s best path forward? Theoretically, would it send a stronger signal to US regulators if Facebook simply shut down all operation in the EU? A pop up message to all EU citizens along the lines of “You may no longer access Facebook from within the EU due to X Y and Z from your government. As such, all of y…

Just my impression: if this was Google, then yes. It is very hard to replace Google at this point in time. Facebook is on its way out. Due to the network effect, Facebook will stay relevant for a long time. But if Facebook would leave the EU then it wouldn't take long for other social networks to take its place. Facebook is relevant because everybody is on Facebook. Not because it is such a great service. Personally,…

How so?

Pretty much everything that Google offers has good alternatives, and there are little or no network effects except for YouTube.

E.g. you can use Bing Search, OpenStreetMap/Bing Maps, Office365, Fastmail, LineageOS, AWS/Azure, Vimeo instead of the Google products.

In fact, the search engine is the only product that might be significantly better than alternatives.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#240

Post by kodablah »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #232
kodablah wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "destroying our democracy and societies" Imagine how you have to talk to a doomsayer like that knowing no matter what you say, there will be no chance to get through to him.

Depends, he's not wrong if facebook is used as a propaganda device

Disagree. FB will not be our destruction. This kind of hyperbole (and getting others to believe it) harms the type of rational discourse they claim they wanted. I disagree with the evasiveness of course, but this is grandstanding and witch-hunting. With those types of statements, how could one expect a productive inquiry? (hint: one couldn't...it was pandering/posturing and it accomplished that goal)
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