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Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

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Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#141

Post by thevardanian »

manishsharan wrote: post #132
thevardanian wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea of Hinduism is nonexistent. What unifies all "religious" and scientific/mathematical theories in India, is the fundamental idea of Dharma. Sikhism, Jainism, Buddhism, and the various schools that are characterized as "Hinduism", all in one way or another layout vast theories about "Dharma" is, and give their own varying definitions of it. Calling this a "Dharma Protocol" is more apt than people think, and I'…

The fundamental ideas of Sikhism , Jainism and Buddism are not equivalent and Dharma in in each of these religions means aderence to their idea of the righteous way.These ideas are distinct and practitioner of these religions would dissmiss your theory of unified dharma. There are several Sikh scholars that I know of who could help you with your understanding of Sikhism and how it is different from Hinduism. However,…

I never said that each were equivalent, I'm saying that they're using the same vocabulary to describe and translate their ideas. That's it.

That is to say there is no universal, central, or dogmatic theory of "dharma", nor perhaps a central agreed upon theory of Dharma, just a vague conception of what it is for each individual interpreter. Whether that interpreter be Buddha, Nanak, Shankaracarya, or the various other Indic philosophers is irrelevant. What unifies them simply is the technical language used to describe their philosophy, and define their own ideas.

So no. I'm not saying all religions in India are the same. All I'm saying is that the various philosophers within that geography used a similar set of vocabulary, and a similar set of ideas to construct their own thought structures in competition, opposition, or in general progression with each other.

So in that sense, there is at least something that makes them closer to each other than they are separate.

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#143

Post by spookthesunset »

bpforster24 wrote: post #123
aphextron wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly is the use case for a 100% secured loan?

Even if you 100% collateralize, you can get 2x leverage. That leverage can be applied to all sorts of use-cases, but we think one of the main ones that will be common today is speculative margin trading (e.g., short selling)

So basically, like all crypto it’s just another layer of speculative trading, fraud and scams all the way down?

Congratulations, I guess...

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#144

Post by spookthesunset »

bpforster24 wrote: post #122
jakecrouch wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am interested in knowing if there are advantages to using blockchain generally outside of Bitcoin - I don't understand it in this case from reading the post. A centralized exchange could be fully transparent, publishing every transaction, and handle every type of debt, if it wanted to.

Censorship resistance is a big factor - since no one entity controls the Ethereum blockchain or smart contracts that have been deployed to Ethereum, there is no way to shut down the service. This paves the way to a single global capital market that is much more inclusive and efficient than the haphazard and heavily intermediated capital markets we have today.

It absolutely is not censorship resistant. It is 100% mob rule. Smart contracts are complete horseshit and this one will be no different. See also: the DAO. Can’t work and never will.

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#145

Post by spookthesunset »

TTPrograms wrote: post #96
jakecrouch wrote: post #84

What is the advantage of using the blockchain rather than creating a fully centralized debt exchange?

A privately owned centralized debt exchange company can go out of business.

And one of these can fork itself to leave you stranded if the mob (or top of the pyramid) switch to another more popular fork. You’ll be left holding a bag of worthless tokens. You’ve traded the entire legal infrastructure for mob rule.

This project, like all crypto projects, is fundamentally flawed. The only difference is this one somehow managed to con a bunch of VC folk into funding it.

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#146

Post by spookthesunset »

dmitrygr wrote: post #111

So, you've reinvented fractional reserve banking, minus all the protections we've built into the modern version of it we all use today through decades of hard lessons? Should be fun.

Welcome to the crypto “space”. It is a bunch of people who don’t understand math, finance, politics, monetary policy, legislation, government, economics, computer science, or seemingly life itself. All sit around and rediscover why society is shaped the way it is...

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#147

Post by imdsm »

sambull wrote: post #134
arcaster wrote: post #108

This service sounds incredible! However, naming it "Plex" seems like a bit of a hiccup since most just think of Plex as the most pervasive home media server in existence...

Or that currency I used to buy my first space ship. In eve online.

ISK was the currency, PLEX was the subscription, right? Or did you use PLEX to buy it?

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#148

Post by wastedhours »

nradov wrote: post #126
nahollander wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The collateral can be any other asset that is represented by a cryptographic token. Right now, few crypto-assets map to real world assets in some capacity, but we're willing to make a bet that this will change faster than most expect. Already, though, there are many interesting assets in the world of crypto that are particularly well suited to being put up for collateral -- namely, the emerging class of crypto-collec…

Why would there ever be a cryptographic token representing my house or car? It just doesn't make any sense. The map is not the territory.

I'm not a crypto-apologist, but this use case I can see (sorry if it's a little rambling).

Each property/car could essentially be represented by its own smart contract, initially held by the mortgage lender. When you pay an instalment of your mortgage, it executes the contract to "release" the equity to you.

When it comes to selling, to change the name on the contract, the buyer would pay based on the split between the lender and the owner, or pay to the owner who has to close the contract with the bank (in the event of moving to a new property, the bank and owner get their relevant proportions on Property 2's smart contract, and it goes again).

You could then "lend" out the equity you've earned from the bank, and use it as collateral for something else, getting it back once you've satisfied the terms of that agreement (meaning, if you don't, the person you lent it to is a creditor on the selling of the house/closing of the contract).

It's essentially automating/giving an interface to an existing contractual relationship. I think this interface might actually be clearer for some people who are financially uneducated, as it expresses their ownership percentage, debt obligations, and potential secured borrowing options in one go. Whilst a lot of it could be done without the crypto side of things if everything happens with the same bank/group of people, with buying and selling assets, you're working on trust with a bunch of different organisations and people, the ledger aspect could help with this.

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#149

Post by dustingetz »

chii wrote: post #115
dustingetz wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider finance options contracts. It's math, there aren't ambiguities, "that's not a bug, it's a feature". Also consider that if lawyering was not an available tool in software contracts, there would still be a game theoretic equilibrium, just a different one, but markets would still function. Before contract law there were other coordinating forces, such as royalty and religion, and things worked out well enough.…

> such as royalty and religion That's because they had the power to go to war to enforce their contracts. Etherium holders do not have such power, so ultimately, relies on the country's laws to enforce the smart contract.

Game theory is the more fundamental thing that power ultimately derives from. From the paper I linked:

"Focal arbitration power is power to redefine property rights, which of course may be profitable for the focal arbitrator himself. But a society's generally understood rules for recognizing leaders can impose constraints what a leader must do if he wants to retain his generally recognized position of authority."

Re: Launch HN: Dharma (YC S17) an open protocol for borrowing/lending cryptoassets

#150

Post by bjl »

wastedhours wrote: post #148
nradov wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would there ever be a cryptographic token representing my house or car? It just doesn't make any sense. The map is not the territory.

I'm not a crypto-apologist, but this use case I can see (sorry if it's a little rambling). Each property/car could essentially be represented by its own smart contract, initially held by the mortgage lender. When you pay an instalment of your mortgage, it executes the contract to "release" the equity to you. When it comes to selling, to change the name on the contract, the buyer would pay based on the split between t…

That's all well and good until someone steals my private keys and and now I'm out a house.
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