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Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

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Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#31

Post by nodesocket »

How is TechCrunch still making the front page of HN? They are the masters of incendiary and polarizing "news" with the only goal to generate "outrage" and clicks and thus revenue. Hacker News audience still eats it up I guess.

Have we not learned anything by exposing the Russian mind-warfare ads that targeted US citizens? They played both-sides, with the goal of polarization, destabilization, and control. The same can be attributed to media such as TechCrunch, just with less lofty goals that of Russia.. Money.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#32

Post by kybernetikos »

ericdykstra wrote: post #21

If anything, this kind of regulation helps companies like Facebook keep their "monopoly", because it raises the monetary cost of starting a competitor. A number of smaller services and games have shut down due to increased cost of compliance, even for companies that don't have any privacy issues.

Someone who runs a club recently told me he was moving all comms to Facebook because of the GDPR. He says that means that he is not collecting user data only Facebook is and so he doesn't have to worry about GDPR things.

This is a bit awkward for me since I don't use Facebook.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#33

Post by AstralStorm »

sparkling wrote: post #23

The EU and its officials are a joke. I cringe when these EU bureaucrats act like they are going to "get tough" on US businesses and the Trump administration. They lack digital sovereignty and nation state sovereignty. Local and federal EU agencies continue to depend on Microsoft and other US tech giants. They didn't even manage to unveil the NSA wiretapping, to this day still not a single person or company has been c…

Other than being politics as usual (which are a joke because politicians are not equipped for dealing with complex issues other than public relations)...

If EU died, who do you think would take over and why do you think they'd be any better?

US has problems of its own with "digital sovereignty" as it allowed China to take over most of manufacturing. Russia is saddled with social debts and social warfare. EU nation states on their own can't do nothing - the business mostly goes to "where value is". (Just look at what is happening in Romania - the question is, how long can they keep it up.)

As for the tax haven, the new regulations in quite a few baton states of the EU now require paying tax in the country where business is done, not registered. Obviously companies try to dodge this as much as they can.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#34

Post by kiriakasis »

vixen99 wrote: post #7
zaarn wrote: post #2

From what I gathered on news sources, most of the (german) MEPs are extremely pissed at Zuckerberg in regards to the question answered, the format of the Q&A and the refusal to livestream a real Q&A. He brought up the question about FB's monopoly on the market, stating that there are plenty of competitor products ("we might have a monopoly on cars but there are still planes, bikes and walking!"). Zuck didn't make fri…

The form of the meeting gave no chance for more than fleeting cross-questioning and ensured that while sharp questions could be asked in plenty Zuckerberg was free to respond with loose generalities and was never put on the spot.

That is the point I think, let him show his commitment or his lack thereof.

He did answer the spiky questions by ignoring them. (I know a real answer would be more useful to us, but I believe that what most interested MEP were Zuckerberg intents)

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#35

Post by hvidgaard »

ericdykstra wrote: post #27
adrianN wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What alternative do you propose? The free market obviously fails to address privacy issues, I don't see how anything besides stricter regulation can help the affected people here.

I'm not a policymaker, but GDPR seems overly-reactionary, over-reaching, and not well thought-out. I think the negative unintended consequences are likely much greater than however much it actually protects the privacy of individuals (which I don't think will be much at all).

GDPR is mostly a regulation that was a directive (DPD) before. If you handled data responsible before and didn't do shady stuff with it, there is little extra to do to be GDPR compliant.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#36

Post by FranzFerdiNaN »

weinzierl wrote: post #19

Most press I’ve read so far in Europe is largely neutral or positive about Zuckerberg but very negative about the procedings, the parliament and conduct of the representatives. This is unusual but in my option justified. Here is one particularly devastating article (Google Translate): https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&...

Looking at the Dutch media it's the complete opposite of what you say. It's mostly about Zuckerberg not saying much, to the frustration of the members of parliament.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#37

Post by valesco »

Tharkun wrote: post #18
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're not allowed to say usage of an application/service is conditional on accepting data collection.

I still don't see why not. Maybe it's what GDPR says, but it's wrong and I can't see this being enforced. If data collection is the "payment" for using the "service", you have two choices: you don't pay and don't use the service, or you pay up. This is like saying a business can't make usage of a service conditional to payment.

This is a uniquely American point of view on a European law though.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#38

Post by worble »

Tharkun wrote: post #18
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're not allowed to say usage of an application/service is conditional on accepting data collection.

I still don't see why not. Maybe it's what GDPR says, but it's wrong and I can't see this being enforced. If data collection is the "payment" for using the "service", you have two choices: you don't pay and don't use the service, or you pay up. This is like saying a business can't make usage of a service conditional to payment.

The point is that the user should be given the choice. In this scenario, your consent is automatically assumed as given despite not even being given the chance to say no.

Maybe I don't want to use your site if you want to collect my data, and I would rather leave before you do so.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#39

Post by CapacitorSet »

ericdykstra wrote: post #21

If anything, this kind of regulation helps companies like Facebook keep their "monopoly", because it raises the monetary cost of starting a competitor. A number of smaller services and games have shut down due to increased cost of compliance, even for companies that don't have any privacy issues.

Is Facebook monopoly any worse than having multiple actors in the data collection field? If anything, having more competitors would push each to be more cunning in their collection and retention of data, to appear more valuable to stakeholders.

One evil is better than two.

Re: Zuckerberg didn’t make any friends in Europe today

#40

Post by melicerte »

zaarn wrote: post #2

From what I gathered on news sources, most of the (german) MEPs are extremely pissed at Zuckerberg in regards to the question answered, the format of the Q&A and the refusal to livestream a real Q&A. He brought up the question about FB's monopoly on the market, stating that there are plenty of competitor products ("we might have a monopoly on cars but there are still planes, bikes and walking!"). Zuck didn't make fri…

Just to be exact, I think the MEP you quoted is Guy Verhofstadt[1], who is of Belgian nationality.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Verhofstadt

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