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Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

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Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#71

Post by mbfg »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #19

Just my own perspective: as one who believes God is responsible for the origin, complexity, and diversity of life, this article makes me chuckle. The theory of evolution as an explanation of the origin of the major taxa of life really paints us into a corner from which it is difficult to wiggle out. In my opinion, the panspermia/alien origin hypothesis (and its persistence as an explanation in some respected circles)…

Evolution doesn't make any claims about the origin of life, only how it evolves over time, and how speciation occurs.

You want to rail against abiogenesis i suppose, because a magic being with fairy dust outside of time and space is more likely.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#72

Post by mbfg »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #51
tree_of_item wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The theory of evolution as an explanation of the origin of the major taxa of life really paints us into a corner from which it is difficult to wiggle out. I'm really not sure what you mean by this. > Also, the insistence on a distinction between "alien" and "divine" has no rational basis What?? You don't see a distinction between life on another planet and supernatural phenomena...?

> I'm really not sure what you mean by this. If you assume the major groups of life evolved from common ancestors, the fossil record doesn't offer a lot of help to fill in the early details (i.e. transitional types). Also, you have the problem of the origin of the first single-cell organism. > You don't see a distinction between life on another planet and supernatural phenomena...? My point is that insisting on it be…

>> what is the difference between an unknown alien life form and God as the origin of life, other than different starting assumptions?

for one, we do know that there _are_ life forms.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#73

Post by xbmcuser »

foo101 wrote: post #30

Here is what I would like to understand: If there is any truth to the theory that Octopuses indeed evolved in outer space and were delivered to our planet via a cosmic payload, how is it that they happened to have the same kind of protein-based, DNA-based genetics like we have? Isn't it too much of a stretch to imagine that an alien evolved under similar conditions with similar genetic foundation like life evolved in…

Maybe they are the only alien species to survive because their dna and biolgy found earths enviroment habitable due to the similarities. Others that landed simply couldn't surive.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#74

Post by mbfg »

yigu wrote: post #3

A few questions that pop into my head: Why did land insects never rise to match the intelligence of the octopus? If octopuses are so smart, why aren't they more social? Why is it that the most social of animals, ants (which are considered eusocial actually), are not pressed with becoming smarter? Why does sex cause octopuses to self-destruct? Also, when it comes to weird theories, I have always thought that if we are…

> Why does sex cause octopuses to self-destruct?

Yeah, this has got to be one of the saddest parts. As smart as these creatures are, they really must start over again from ground zero for every generation. Imagine what they could do if they had parents to teach them behaviourly as they grew up.

I assume we have no better luck keeping moms alive in captivity when breeding as well?

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#75

Post by 0xBA5ED »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #67
0xBA5ED wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This literally means that God is not "all powerful". And if there are things he is simply incapable of experiencing, this also means he is not "all knowing".

Yes it does mean that. However, he is "all powerful" where it matters - to accomplish his own will, which is consistent with his character.

If he is controlled by "his nature", then it isn't HIS will.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#76

Post by indiv0 »

eco wrote: post #56
agar wrote: post #12

As much as I love the concept, I can only imagine what a professional with expertise in cephalopods and their DNA would think while reading this article. If you've ever read a popular press story in your area of expertise, you immediately see how many things writers oversimplify to the point of absurdity, or just get plain wrong. I'm guessing the authors of that journal article, were they to read this news story, wou…

> If you've ever read a popular press story in your area of expertise, you immediately see how many things writers oversimplify to the point of absurdity, or just get plain wrong. I could have sworn there was a named Effect/Rule given to an extension of this but my googling is coming up short. It was about how you'll read a mainstream article about something you know a great deal about and see how much the journalist…

Slightly off-topic, but boy you weren't kidding. That topic is ungoogleable if you don't know the specific term for it. I spent 20 minutes or so trying various combinations of words trying to get it.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#78

Post by whataretensors »

The eventual babelfish trained using unsupervised alignment may make things like bird->human or octopus->human possible(or mycellial mass, if it turns out to be intelligent).

I have a suspicion that in the future human-centric mono-species intelligence and consciousness assumptions will be tested, and the outcome may be similar to discovering other galaxies in terms of the impact on humanity's collective psyche.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#79

Post by peteretep »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #57
peteretep wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is ridiculous, and I'd also point out, despite my being atheist, that it's blasphemous. Monotheistic religions (almost all) believe in an omnipotent God. Omnipotent means that nothing binds the hand of God, at all. An omnipotent being can literally contrive any situation; they can change anything, from moment to moment, without leaving any traces whatsoever. They can change the very nature of logic itself withou…

Speaking for Christianity, God's omnipotence does not mean he can violate his own nature. In fact, he is very limited in the sense that there are an infinite number of things that he cannot do because they are inconsistent with his nature -- his holiness, truth, love, and wisdom.

> In fact, he is very limited in the sense

That's blasphemy, and you take it upon yourself to interpret and understand His divine will, and second guess Him, despite being warned over and over that His will is beyond your understanding. Your comments are a textbook example of the type of human arrogance that gets Biblical characters unstuck, over and over and over again.

> he is very limited in the sense that there are an infinite number of things that he cannot do

I would be interested to see canonical scriptural references for this statement.

Re: Group of scientists suggest that octopuses might actually be aliens

#80

Post by AlexCoventry »

natecavanaugh wrote: post #35

This strangely reminds me of a Wired article[0] from 2013 where it quotes a scientist in this way: "If you want to study an alien intelligence, Godfrey-Smith says, 'octopuses are the closest thing we have.'" Though it doesn't make the claim that it's of alien origin, nor do I subscribe to the theory necessarily. There's just too much question-begging in the theories that life is somehow of extraterrestrial origin (wh…

> question-begging in the theories that life is somehow of extraterrestrial origin (where did that life come from?).

I really dislike this paper, but they do address that. The fact that life had to start somewhere doesn't make the question of extraterrestrial origin any less interesting.

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