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GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

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Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#371

Post by dragonwriter »

fencepost wrote: post #362
fcbrooklyn wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TIL in some states they do emissions checks (although in a lot of states motorcycles are totally exempt from those anyway). And no, they don't do safety inspections of "specially constructed vehicles". And based on the ones I've seen, I can't imagine a world in which they'd pass. [1] [1] http://bosshoss.com/supersport-bike/

However, at least some states (probably most) require a minimum level of insurance from a carrier licensed in the state. There's nothing that requires those carriers to provide insurance to vehicles that don't meet their minimum requirements.

> However, at least some states (probably most) require a minimum level of insurance from a carrier licensed in the state.

Don't most have a bond alternative to insurance?

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#372

Post by jcims »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #268

The overreaction to GDPR from US tech startups in particular surprised me at first. But my partner is a lawyer working on GDPR compliance for a variety of tech firms, and he explained that there's almost a historical cultural difference in terms of attitudes to ownership of personal data. European regulation typically treats personal data as being the property of the person being identified; US tradition considers da…

It's not really 'unnecessary' if you didn't account for the objectives of the GDPR in your initial design. Assign any moral attributes you like to it, if GDPR requires substantial tinkering with your product then it's reasonable to be concerned.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#373

Post by gray_-_wolf »

mnkypete wrote: post #5

There is so much misconception about GDPR. It is cleary directed at large data-tracking corps, not single person IM apps. Even if someone tries to "sue" you (which he can't, only report you to authorities), it first needs to go through many iterations where you can make your case. At the very least read this: https://privacylawblog.fieldfisher.com/2016/what-you-think-y...

> It is cleary directed at large data-tracking corps, not single person IM apps.

Sure, but that's not actually written anywhere.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#374

Post by jimmaswell »

lovich wrote: post #365
jimmaswell wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I find it equally disgusting that you think users' feelings are more important than webmasters' property rights.

Holy shit man, did you come right out of "Atlas Shrugged"? This isnt even users feelings, this is data that can a:have monetary value and b:can be plain wrong and damage a user. Do you think that merely by observing data you have right to it? Do you not believe in any IP law? If you agree with any type of IP law then you are just being hypocritical by insisting that webmasters get to take and use whatever data they c…

>Do you think that merely by observing data you have right to it?

Yes, with some exceptions for actual copyright and the like.

>Do you not believe in any IP law?

IP law, yes, but I don't feel a user's entries into a website automatically qualify as IP owned by the user. The terms of many websites actually say that whatever you upload to them is owned by the website, unless a prior IP applied to it. I've only ever heard the claim that your name et al. are your inherent IP from "Sovereign Citizens" before.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#375

Post by s73v3r_ »

ucaetano wrote: post #212
jacquesm wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your businessmodel does not allow for the proper dealing with the information it collects you shouldn't be in business in the first place.

issue isn't the business model, is the size. For a large company, handling GDPR is trivial. For a startup or small company, the cost is prohibitively high. I'm not arguing for or against it, just pointing that the resulting unintended consequence is protecting large companies. Exactly the opposite of the original intent.

People keep saying this, but I flat out don't believe it.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#376

Post by fiter »

kuschku wrote: post #334
zerostar07 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the laws you refer to preexisted. Did they tear down all the houses that don't comply with contemporary building standards? I dont think so. GDPR is enforced retroactively on everything since the beginning of the internet.

> Did they tear down all the houses that don't comply with contemporary building standards? No, they fined everyone that owns homes commercially that did not upgrade the homes to comply. And then fined them again. And again, until they complied.

For what it's worth, this is not generally done in the US.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#377

Post by danbruc »

emidln wrote: post #355
danbruc wrote: post #255

While Monal is privacy focused, it is also free, open source and run by a single person — me. I simply do not have the resources or the time to jump through the regulatory hoops required by the EU. As a new and small construction company we simply don't have the resources to comply with all the building codes and the related paperwork. I just can't afford to meet all food safety requirements, I just want to provide f…

I made this software program that listens on a port on my computer, located in Springfield, IL, USA. I allow other people to connect to this program over the internet, which terminates at a connection I pay Comcast to provide me. I log their IP addresses (on my server that I own which resides in the United States) because I'm curious where my users are coming from. Someone from Europe is claiming that I owe them some…

You have to respect the privacy of people in the same way you have to respect their lives. You can not harm or kill random people, you can not do arbitrary things with information about them.

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#378

Post by fencepost »

mnkypete wrote: post #5

There is so much misconception about GDPR. It is cleary directed at large data-tracking corps, not single person IM apps. Even if someone tries to "sue" you (which he can't, only report you to authorities), it first needs to go through many iterations where you can make your case. At the very least read this: https://privacylawblog.fieldfisher.com/2016/what-you-think-y...

If there is a complaint against my small software company, are there limits on how much I'm required to spend on defense? Do I have to travel to Europe to defend my company or will investigators from Europe travel to my location at their own expense? Will I be reimbursed for reasonable expenses if the complaint is groundless? Are there parts of the regulation that act like strong anti-SLAPP laws in some states?

Can my small company be trivially bankrupted by any sociopathic gamer skid with an EU address and a grudge when DDOS attacks fail?

"You can beat the rap but you can't beat the ride."

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#379

Post by lovich »

jimmaswell wrote: post #144
robin_reala wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of GDPR is to switch collecting users’ personal data from being a benefit to being a liability. That will absolutely cause short term pain to some companies that hadn’t expected this, but it ends up as a long term benefit to society, the same as most legislation.

Do you have a source for most legislation being a long term benefit to society? If forcing low-earning EU citizens off the internet because every website requires a subscription is a social good to you, then sure, it's a long term benefit.

Is the internet even a net benefit with this current trend towards turning everything into clickbait or some other psychological experiment to get traffic and harvest data off of it? How useful is the average website now compared to what the internet was like in the 2000's?

Even if it would all be a net benefit, why is it ok for all of these companies to be so misleading about it. No one out a simple EULA, for what is happening with the data. Hell half the agreements just say that the companies can do whatever with the data, but an average person does not have the ability to parse the output of the legal teams of every company they interact with every day. The only way this could get even close to an equal footing between users and companies is if every single person was a lawyer

Re: GDPR: Removing Monal from the EU

#380

Post by cyphar »

zerostar07 wrote: post #299
jacquesm wrote: post #273

This is a ridiculous over-reaction based on an extremely shallow interpretation of the GDPR. If you are running a small business and you feel that you won't be able to operate your business because of the GDPR consider all those other laws that you have to be in compliance with as well. If that's your attitude towards legal compliance then you should probably shut your business down completely rather than to hope tha…

You can be respective of privacy without complying with GDPR. It requires a lot more than simply being privacy-conscious. (E.g. I don't think Hacker News is doing anything unethical even though they blatantly violate GDPR) > Legal compliance is a requirement for any business You are required to comply with the laws of your country, not those of other countries.

> You are required to comply with the laws of your country, not those of other countries.

No, you are required to comply with the laws of any country you do business with. This applies to any type of business, and I don't see why "it's on the internet" appears to be the main counter-argument.

If I buy something from you (via snail-mail or on the internet) and it doesn't follow the requirements of the consumer law in my country, I can ask you to comply with the laws of my country. If you refuse, I can report you and you will be fined (if you don't pay, then you can have your right to do business in my country revoked). In practice most cases won't escalate that far, but the principle is the same.

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