What if JavaScript wins?

#1

Post by thisisit » Wed, May 16, 2018, 3:52 PM UTC

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#2

Post by captainbland » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:13 PM UTC

I think within a few years WASM will finally be in a place where it becomes usable without relying on JavaScript for interfacing with the web browser and people will be able to develop high-performance, isomorphic web applications in other programming languages. This will definitely start to eat into it as it makes gains elsewhere. As such, I don't really see JavaScript reaching the level of dominance implied in this article - and to be honest, I wouldn't want it to when Oracle has gone after developers for naming it as something they support on trademark grounds.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/04/18/oracle_ios_app_take...

Honestly, I think JavaScript at some point - not in the near future - will see its 'Flash' moment where a large organisation stops supporting it entirely if Oracle keeps up stuff like this.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#3

Post by bitL » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:36 PM UTC

Use JavaScript or its wrappers (TypeScript, Dart etc.) just to glue modules written in C++ or other sane language, compiled into WASM. That's the future. JavaScript's role will be diminishing, paradoxically when it is now becoming an actually usable language, e.g. finally removing callback hell by async/await, adding some "borrowed" stuff from Scala etc.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#4

Post by anaheim_ducks » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:45 PM UTC

Blazor and similar technologies built on WASM are the future of web dev.

http://blog.stevensanderson.com/2018/02/06/blazor-intro/

I no longer read articles on JavaScript or related libraries, it's all obsolete. I know enough JS and TypeScript to get by until WASM-based tech takes over, hopefully within 2 years.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#5

Post by chadlavi » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:50 PM UTC

Anil!

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#6

Post by kizer » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

All the C derivatives are getting closer to one-another. How different are Typescript, C-sharp, and Java? When JavaScript adds gradual typing, interface, etc. won't all these languages be nearly the same? The runtimes will differ but the language features and syntax will be almost the same.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#7

Post by Touche » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:55 PM UTC

anaheim_ducks wrote: post #4

Blazor and similar technologies built on WASM are the future of web dev. http://blog.stevensanderson.com/2018/02/06/blazor-intro/ I no longer read articles on JavaScript or related libraries, it's all obsolete. I know enough JS and TypeScript to get by until WASM-based tech takes over, hopefully within 2 years.

Given the popularity of Node.js, I doubt this. JavaScript is still winning when people have the option to use C# or C++ or Scala or whatever else.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#8

Post by Someone1234 » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:56 PM UTC

Mark my words, Web ASM will be just as opaque as traditional assembly languages. Which is to say that we'll shift the problem from "JavaScript is bad" to "I cannot debug this," "I cannot see what this script does," "I lost the original source code, and now I have to reverse engineer WASM! Help!"

WASM isn't a panacea. Much like Flash, Java Applets, and ActiveX it is just the newest in a long line of Magic Blobs™ that supposedly solve all of our problems. Sooner or later it will become so complex that even the prospect of manually reviewing WASM will be seen as more unrealistic than a simple re-write based on input/output conditions.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#9

Post by kartan » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:58 PM UTC

The missing point is that other languages have bigger/more specialized ecosystems.

For the networking effect to exist, your network doesn't needs to be just big. But it needs to be bigger than the rest. That's why people don't leave Facebook.

Java, C#, C++, Python have big ecosystems with specialized libraries for enterprise applications, performance, data analytics, etc.

If any, Javascript is already decreasing its influence in the web. Unity3D works with C# and it is removing support for its own version of Javascript. Or your choice may be Unreal Engine and C++. Or you can use Emscripten with C++ to build your own solution.

JavaScript is a language with a lot of problems. The final blow is going to be WebAssembly, as it will open direct web development to all other languages.

JavaScript will stay with us for long. But I don't think that is reaching its peak right now.

Re: What if JavaScript wins?

#10

Post by Felk » Wed, May 16, 2018, 4:59 PM UTC

kizer wrote: post #6

All the C derivatives are getting closer to one-another. How different are Typescript, C-sharp, and Java? When JavaScript adds gradual typing, interface, etc. won't all these languages be nearly the same? The runtimes will differ but the language features and syntax will be almost the same.

I'm not sure if this is a good or a bad thing. On one side we might get stuck on a local maximum as all languages stick to the universally established features to be marketable, on the other side it seems that some arguably objectively useful abstractions crystallize, which makes things easier for everyone.