141–150 of 336 posts
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not the python one! https://google.github.io/styleguide/pyguide.html anything other than 4 spaces for python look out of place for me.
This is either outdated or only for the public version of the guide: the internal guide, and all our python code, has 2-spaces indents.
> Indent 2 spaces It's interesting how quickly the 2-space indent became the new norm
On the flip side of things, you have developers who universally write 240+ col lines in HTML and don't know what a punched card is.
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Exchanging Bash for Python is a folly. Python seems to handle complexity better, but only on the surface. (Basically Python has nice data structures, great string formatting, and .. that's it.) Setting up the Python environment requires something, because Python comes in many flavors (2 vs 3, system installed, user installed, /usr/local) and there are a bunch of factors (pip, pyenv, pipenv, PYTHONPATH, current direct…
You’ve hit most of it. The desire is a lowest common denominator. Python, Ruby, etc would be great except that in some of the places there arent current versions and beyond the most mundane you end up wanting 3rd party packages, which complicates your packaging or removes that lowest common denominator property. What it begs is for a new tool. A single file, statically linked “super shell” that lets you do structured…
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Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's nonsense. Historically, PowerShell was supposed to be a replacement for cmd.exe and roughly equivalent to bash, yet suitable for the Windows environment. They tried early on to port some of the UNIX & Linux tools to Windows and it didn't fly, so this is what we're left with. Although parts of Powershell are open source now, I suspect the mere existence of WSL means that M…
> Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's nonsense. In PowerShell you pass structured data around instead of globs of text, which is much more maintainable. Using Bash on Windows is like going backwards, and it's sad that most developers don't even realize it. > Historically, PowerShell was supposed to be a replacement for cmd.exe and roughly equivalent to bash, yet suitable for the Windows environment. They tr…
It would be, if cmd.exe was long dead, PowerShell had stolen the good parts and continued on its way, but we're not there yet. Cmd.exe still exists on Win 10 and let's not even get into the fact that 64 bit only versions of Windows are not yet everywhere. Sure, Microsoft's ecosystem is larger and more complex, but at some point Win32 becomes a liability and unnecessary baggage.
> Which is sad, since it could have been so much more. The Unix way of doing things, isn't the be all and all.
Cultural compatibility matters - See C & C++. How else do you expect to get users and developers on board if you can't show them how your system is better in a few key ways, but isn't a giant leap from what they're currently using?
Tl;dr Change is scary, try to make it less so.
I absolutely hate coding in bash or looking at bash or suddenly being in Windows and being up a tree because bash isn't supported well (it is now if you install WSL). I only use bash to set environment variables and maybe string together 2 or 3 build commands. If I need so much as an if statement, I'm going to switch to a real programming language.
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for i in ‘ls /tmp/foo’; do echo $i | grep bar | cut -d’-‘ -f3,4; done Is just so much easier to remember than Python’s OS library, right? I can intuitively string that together but can’t write python without looking up the docs and reading a paragraph about idiosyncrasies.
I said Python wasn't going to be more concise. I said it has a variety of other useful properties. For instance, at least as I write this, you have "cut -d’-‘"; I assume you meant apostrophes (something getting too polite in a c&p, I assume) but the apostrophes are unnecessary, but you're so used to the compromises in shell I talked about you probably put those in there automatically. I'm not criticizing that; it's a…
I absolutely hate coding in bash or looking at bash or suddenly being in Windows and being up a tree because bash isn't supported well (it is now if you install WSL). I only use bash to set environment variables and maybe string together 2 or 3 build commands. If I need so much as an if statement, I'm going to switch to a real programming language.
This document agrees with you. - If you find you need to use arrays for anything more than assignment of ${PIPESTATUS}, you should use Python. - If you are writing a script that is more than 100 lines long, you should probably be writing it in Python instead. Bear in mind that scripts grow. Rewrite your script in another language early to avoid a time-consuming rewrite at a later date.
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Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's nonsense. Historically, PowerShell was supposed to be a replacement for cmd.exe and roughly equivalent to bash, yet suitable for the Windows environment. They tried early on to port some of the UNIX & Linux tools to Windows and it didn't fly, so this is what we're left with. Although parts of Powershell are open source now, I suspect the mere existence of WSL means that M…
> Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's nonsense. In PowerShell you pass structured data around instead of globs of text, which is much more maintainable. Using Bash on Windows is like going backwards, and it's sad that most developers don't even realize it. > Historically, PowerShell was supposed to be a replacement for cmd.exe and roughly equivalent to bash, yet suitable for the Windows environment. They tr…
As a 20 year bash veteran: powershell is the first OS default shell that outputs structured data, and looking at objects and selecting the properties you want is a massive improvement than combining bash with sed/grep/awk to scrape text.
Someone bizarrely responds that cmd still exists on Windows for compatibility purposes (though even Win+X starts powershell now) doesn't change this at all.
The README for my powershell profile (which is written from a *nix PoV) has a little more info comparing the two: https://github.com/mikemaccana/powershell-profile
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It is, but don't forget it's a guide for Google engineers on the Google machines. People who share code for the world to use should use: - `#!/usr/bin/env bash` - or `#!/bin/sh` for POSIX shell scripting
/bin/sh is most often either the C shell, Dash, or Ash, not the Bourne shell. Bourne shell extensions will cause the script to fail. edit: bourne again shell
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It is, but don't forget it's a guide for Google engineers on the Google machines. People who share code for the world to use should use: - `#!/usr/bin/env bash` - or `#!/bin/sh` for POSIX shell scripting
/bin/sh is most often either the C shell, Dash, or Ash, not the Bourne shell. Bourne shell extensions will cause the script to fail. edit: bourne again shell