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Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

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Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_effect

You need to make a sentence to make a point

I am not making a point, I am simply providing a reference for you to read up on the basics of the stuff that you so confidently speak about.

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds a bit challenging: They'd still need to pay the corporate ISPs to carry or to not completely deprioritize traffic from hackerISP, or else nobody else could reach the hackers' great websites, services, ideas, etc. If hackerISP carried things the corporates didn't like, they could still throttle or kill access to it or to individual domains, protocols, etc. And how will hackerISP pay for nationwide infrastr…

> "And how will hackerISP pay for nationwide infrastructure?" Depending on where you live, ISPs do not need to own their own infrastructure. For a bit more information into how this can work, I'd recommend taking a look at local loop unbundling: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local-loop_unbundling Also, GP is alluding to things that have already happened in the past, in the wild west days of the Internet it was more…

> Depending on where you live, ISPs do not need to own their own infrastructure. For a bit more information into how this can work, I'd recommend taking a look at local loop unbundling:

So, you are in favor of regulation forcing last-mile operators to allow competitors to use their infrastructure at a competetive price set by the regulator without any discrimination based on the data transmitted, right?

> Also, GP is alluding to things that have already happened in the past, in the wild west days of the Internet it was more common for small ISPs to get started (even with competition from the big ISPs like AOL and CompuServe).

Which didn't compete on the last mile, as the access medium was a telephone line. Consumer ISPs in those days didn't have to have a last mile, they simply used the monopoly's last mile of telephone wire.

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My ISP It was said a few gajillion times, but let me repeat it once again. Here is the real problem: it's singular. My ISP works reasonably well for me, because I have at least 5 other non-wireless options whom I can pay if I'm not satisfied. It is this simple, and I've heard that it works not only where I've lived but in other cities and countries as well. And if all my options collude, then there is government to…

Absolutely this. Competition is the best regulation there is because it responds directly to the customer.

Yeah, true. The best way towards safe food and drugs certainly is by relying on the expertise of the average customer to figure out what's dnagerous and what is not. Who is better equipped to judge the biological long-term effects of some mislabeled, contaminated food than your average customer?

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My ISP It was said a few gajillion times, but let me repeat it once again. Here is the real problem: it's singular. My ISP works reasonably well for me, because I have at least 5 other non-wireless options whom I can pay if I'm not satisfied. It is this simple, and I've heard that it works not only where I've lived but in other cities and countries as well. And if all my options collude, then there is government to…

Absolutely this. Competition is the best regulation there is because it responds directly to the customer.

Counterpoints: Tobacco. Cocaine. Morphine. Heroin. Laudanum. Alcohol. Car seatbelts. Leaded gasoline, paint, and glassware. Mercury (in hats, as a toy). Radon (in water), X-rays (for shoe fitting!), and Uranium (dentures).

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#155

I am yet to hear anyone who is anti Net Neutrality arguing for electricity or other utilities not to be regulated ...

People often pick and choose their fights. Common utility companies like power and water are pretty different from regulating ISPs.

They're controlled locally, by the state or municipality. So changes in policy don't affect the entire US. The utility companies have their own problems, like not being incentivised to innovate much. Power companies have also pushed for onerous regulations on solar power in the past to maintain their monopoly on providing power.

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to make a sentence to make a point

I am not making a point, I am simply providing a reference for you to read up on the basics of the stuff that you so confidently speak about.

So if all my friends and family are on facebook, I am ~forced~ to use facebook ?

All my friends and family live in my state so I guess I don't have a choice and have to live my whole life in my motherland

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#157
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it is a response to an industry which failed to regulate itself Pretty much everything websites do with your data are from voluntary exchange. We decide to subscribe to a website a visit it regularly and give to it your data. We decide to surf some website without ad blockers / web trackers extensions, and we don't want to pay for social medias and some of us actually like well targeted ads. I fail to see what the co…

I opened a Facebook about one year ago. The information they had on me was rather disturbing. I never gave Facebook permission, directly or implied, to track my circle of past friends or make assumptions about my personal interests.

Permission was implied when you sent your data to them. Website you visit send you webpages that your browser parse and connect to every tracking widgets present in the html. If you don't like it, configure better your browser.

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#158
post #123
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it is a response to an industry which failed to regulate itself Pretty much everything websites do with your data are from voluntary exchange. We decide to subscribe to a website a visit it regularly and give to it your data. We decide to surf some website without ad blockers / web trackers extensions, and we don't want to pay for social medias and some of us actually like well targeted ads. I fail to see what the co…

> Pretty much everything websites do with your data are from voluntary exchange. Are you joking or are you in denial that much? We have no control most of the time, especially "normal" users. Ad blockers or JavaScript blockers may help, but they are not normal.

Normal users don't have any control because nobody cares enough to take time to dive into this boring issues.

Privacy issues are not (yet) a billion dollar business

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#159
post #91

How many months has it been? I'm quite sick of hearing about net neutrality. Europe has it so if it's so necessary, vote with your feet (hosting and VPN wise) and they'll get the message. And if they block vpns, I've heard great success stories of community Internet which is supposedly faster and cheaper. You might even be able to get net neutrality by just running your own ISP rather than trying to get huge corps in…

That sounds like you given up. Don't let your brittle spirit deter others.

I haven't given up: we already won. That things are crap in freedom country doesn't make me want to scroll past headlines about HELP US for months on end.

Re: Mozilla Fights for Net Neutrality This May (and Always)

#160
post #55
post #6

I still find it amazing that everything has degraded from the independent hacker culture of the 90s to continually begging for the government to control and regulate the Internet. If you ever posted “what the Internet could really use is for the US Congress to control it!” to Usenet or 1999 Slashdot you would have gotten flamed to a crisp. I mean, God knows I’m not going to use a Google product, so I’m sticking with…

What I find amazing is that there are still people on this planet who oppose anything a government does, so they end up at the perils of corporations. I guess, according to you, GDPR is also a Bad Thing (tm)? Hint: it is a response to an industry which failed to regulate itself. When corporations cannot manage themselves, the government must interact by rule of law. An example of that is the sale of frequencies such…

> What I find amazing is that there are still people on this planet who oppose anything a government does, so they end up at the perils of corporations.

Well, no, because if they oppose everything government does, they'd oppose corporations, too, since they are a thing government does.

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