Live data from Hacker News

Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

cs.cmu.edu

291–300 of 362 posts

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#291

I really do not like this move. AI and Machine Learning require graduate-level mathematical and computational skills. I don't think it's productive to pretend that we can train someone to be even remotely useful in these fields in four years of an undergraduate education. It sounds like an attempt to get around the fundamentals of csci to "skip to the interesting bits," which will produce graduates with a cursory kno…

No, you don't need the degree.

Denny Britz, He drops school (his phd) to go into industries.

Christopher Olah: Same story, at least he doesn’t communicate about his education (http://colah.github.io/cv.pdf).

Both are well-known for their expertise, and followed by a large amount of people in the deep learning community.

You can def become an great machine learning engineer who used deep learning technique, without going to any university.

--- Ian Goodfellow:

"One of my biggest heroes is Geoffrey Hinton. His PhD was in experimental psychology ( . Biographical Sketch ).

In mechanical engineering, I think you learn quite a lot of the mathematical tools that are used in machine learning, so you won’t be starting from scratch.

In general, we often find that revolutions in one field happen when someone from another field arrives with fresh ideas that developed elsewhere."

(https://www.quora.com/Would-you-encourage-people-from-anothe...)

How can someone with almost no technical knowledge learn ML?

Ian Goodfellow::"It’s important to master some of the basics, like linear algebra, probability, and python programming.

But you don’t need to know all of linear algebra (I don’t think I’ve ever used a QR decomposition outside the classroom), all of probability (we don’t usually do much involving combinatorics / re-ordering of sequences in deep learning), or all of python programming (a lot of the more obscure language features are actually forbidden at some companies).

I’d say maybe start by learning enough linear algebra, probability, and python programming that you can implement logistic regression yourself, using only python and numpy..."

(https://www.quora.com/How-can-someone-with-almost-no-technic...)

As a college sophomore, how can I prepare myself for artificial intelligence?

Ian Goodfellow:

"Take classes on linear algebra and probability

Take classes on how to write fast code that is friendly to the hardware you’re working with.

Take classes on how to write good high performance, realtime multithreaded code.

Read Deep Learning.

Pick a simple machine learning project that interests you.

Work through this project, and when you have questions about the material you read about machine learning, trying to answer your own questions by running experiments in your project codebase.

If your university has them, take classes on machine learning, computer vision, natural language processing, robotics, etc."

(https://www.quora.com/As-a-college-sophomore-how-can-I-prepa...)

*You can find all the courses online.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#292
post #217
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can teach a kid frequentist (regular) statistics, then you can certainly teach them things like Bayesian statistics. Add things like decision trees (which you need to build something like a chatbot). In fact, a friend of mine from my freshman year (way back before everyone had computers in college) wrote a chatbot. I had never seen anything like it, and he let it loose on IRC. Was pretty cool back when things…

You are describing those models as they are being applied (and as many introduction present them) not how they can be trained. To understand whether those models converge, how to calculate the solution to even a basic linear regression, you need graduate math: matrix algebra, differential calculus, topology.

Unless you mean some sort of differential topology, those are rigorously covered in and respectable math undergraduate.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#293
post #49

This seems like a publicity stunt. It sounds like a CS degree where the electives are predetermined. Why couldn't they just make this a concentration when it's so intimately intertwined with CS. The extra overhead graduates will have to deal with doesn't seem worth it. "AI majors will receive the same solid grounding in computer science and math courses as other computer science students. In addition, they will have…

> It sounds like a CS degree where the electives are predetermined. Why couldn't they just make this a concentration when it's so intimately intertwined with CS

Unless they really mean "CS-degree with surface level knowledge of stats" this should really be an offshoot of the math/applied math department, not CS

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#294
post #251

I really do not like this move. AI and Machine Learning require graduate-level mathematical and computational skills. I don't think it's productive to pretend that we can train someone to be even remotely useful in these fields in four years of an undergraduate education. It sounds like an attempt to get around the fundamentals of csci to "skip to the interesting bits," which will produce graduates with a cursory kno…

> AI and Machine Learning require graduate-level mathematical and computational skills Yeah, not really. A lot of day-to-day work in ML requires rudimentary math, at most. I know PhDs who quickly get discouraged with ML because they're suddenly spending 95% of their time doing the grunt work. It would be a boon if we could hire non-PhDs who are competent in the fundamentals of signals, algorithms, statistics, and exp…

So essentially what we need is an "academic CSEE" degree, where you replace courses on industrial topics like application design and databases / circuits and electromagnetics with these theory-based classes from both departments.

I'd also suggest adding some systems neuroscience courses in there too.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you consider an undergraduate degree in Physics the same as a graduate degree in physics? No, I would not expect a person with an undergrad degree in physics to have nearly the same capabilities and understanding of a PhD holder in general. Similarly, it would be silly to assume the alums from this program are going to be considered to be of the same caliber. Instead, they will fill roles in which having a rich…

Isn’t most AI work in research though? I think the problem most are having with this is we generally consider AI to be more prestigious than something like data science (which seems like it would be a better name for a degree in its own right).

I think I agree with you that the degree might be more aptly named "data science", but that's a relatively minor detail in the scheme of things.

I don't think I would claim most AI work is research, but regardless, I think there is a still quite a lot of work that is quite applied nowadays. For example, there are a huge number of special-use-case neural networks you can think of to make very specific decisions based on image data. Or, nearly every online retailer would love someone to be able to come up with a good recommendation engine for products on their site. While a PhD might build a slightly-better one, I'm fairly confident that an undergrad trained properly (no pun intended) could pull off something usable.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. Many of the statistical concepts can be extended from advanced undergraduate stats too. I can see how the high salaries paid in these jobs would lead to some serious gatekeeping though. My concern is that these courses will likely be taught without any deference to the ethics involved in the work done, and I think that will play an increasingly important role in years to come.

Most undergrad engineering worth its salt will require an ethics course and humanities classes broaching the topic. The main issue is that a lot of people do not take away the intent, or can fully answer questions correctly about the intent but not actually care. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

>Most undergrad engineering worth its salt will require an ethics course and humanities classes broaching the topic.

Someone I knew in college made bank writing papers for engineers' in those ethics courses.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#297

I really do not like this move. AI and Machine Learning require graduate-level mathematical and computational skills. I don't think it's productive to pretend that we can train someone to be even remotely useful in these fields in four years of an undergraduate education. It sounds like an attempt to get around the fundamentals of csci to "skip to the interesting bits," which will produce graduates with a cursory kno…

I disagree

The major sounds similar in intent to the Data Science major we introduced into our Bachelor of Computer Science at UNE (in Australia) last year. These days there is something of a branch in computing routes -- to express it in a very muddy way, designing and building the systems themselves (Software Development) versus applying machine learning algorithms, AI, and statistics across the data systems produce (Data Science). And of course there's other branches and specialisms too, but for our particular market those are what we have at the moment.

The level is still clear -- it's an undergraduate degree, and they are coming out with a good undergraduate's knowledge of the area. So that's entirely appropriate. There's no need to shy away from stating what they've been focusing on (offering a named major). And we do find they are useful and in demand.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#299

I really do not like this move. AI and Machine Learning require graduate-level mathematical and computational skills. I don't think it's productive to pretend that we can train someone to be even remotely useful in these fields in four years of an undergraduate education. It sounds like an attempt to get around the fundamentals of csci to "skip to the interesting bits," which will produce graduates with a cursory kno…

No expert here, but I lived through times when calculus was deemed beyond the capabilities of high school students. This was clearly incorrect.

As I said, no expert in AI & ML, but I don't see anything that differentiates them from other domains earlier (and wrongly) regarded as beyond undergraduate work.

Re: Carnegie Mellon Launches Undergraduate Degree in Artificial Intelligence

#300
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI's curse is that once it becomes mundane people call it "automation". I think that having a focused degree in AI makes sense. I think that AI has reached the level of maturity that a separate curriculum should be made for it. Just as we had no distinction between computer scientists and software engineers we now face a world where AI and or Data Science require a different focus on education.

My only thought on that idea is that it feels like an undergrad in AI is less useful in the sense that most AI positions prefer PHD over masters, let alone undergrad.

[deleted]
Post reply on HN