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Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

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31–40 of 117 posts

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#31
post #7
post #2

I guess low bandwidth is no problem. You only need to send a stream of price changes of the most common instruments (currencies, stocks). And only if there are meaningful movements. I guess a few kbit/s can already provide a lot of value. How fast would such a connection be? Is there an easy way to calculate the distance the signal takes compared to great circle line?

Wouldn't you just send whatever is needed to place the order? Do all of the processing at the source and just send the final instruction? (honest question I have no idea how this works)

You can send samples. E.g. the USD/EUR rate (or the price of an equities future) if it changes by more than x within the last 50ms. The difference of that rate to the "local" rate in London is enough to generate the trade. Same with equity indices. You'll know that if there's no movement, there's no opportunity. So it's enough to send a signal if there has been a significant move that's "young" enough so that the other side can't know it yet.

Your trades only make money on the difference of the public information in London and what you get faster from Chicago. Therefore sending trade instructions isn't helpful as Chicago doesn't know London prices. But just giving the London algorithm that bit of inside can help a lot.

I assume trade strategies are mostly very simple as well. Basically just anticipating a change in price and quickly buying/selling to make some money off it.

N.B.: I only talk about Chicago->London here but given that Chicago hosts one of the largest Futures markets, I'd assume a lot is actually done in reverse. Using local prices from London of an underlying instrument (e.g. London stock market) to "predict" the value of the future traded in Chicago. You can make a lot of money if you know the price of the underlying instrument of a future before others do.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#32
post #23
post #19

Weirdest thing I've read in a long while. The Author's comments refer to an internet forum thread[0] in German which discusses a German news article from this April.[1]However, it turns out this article is an April Fools text. Just digging deeper into the whole blog you can find something that can only be described as a fanfiction representation of "Flashboys", but in the context of this "Shortwave trading".[2] Is th…

Seems like it is real: https://www.six-group.com/en/home/media/releases/2018/201805...

This is microwave based. Those lines are well known by now and there are known routes within Europe (most notable FrankfurtLondon) and the US (NYCChicago). However, microwave only works over short distances (FRALON has multiple towers to cover the distance). Crossing the atlantic isn't possible. Shortwave could deliver a similar speedup over long distances.

I'm a bit sceptical though. Don't the waves have to bounce several times to get to the target? I'm not sure how much of the ~30% potential speed up vs. fibre you still get.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#33
Interesting... I actually know someone working on a project similar to this (who works at an HFT firm) - if not actually this.

His team was simulating and testing how various weather conditions could affect trade placement times. For instance, does a high-pressure system, a heat wave, a blizzard, etc. impact the trade placement times, if so how does that impact the algorithms.

He works out of Chicago and I've heard of similar things before, so this isn't unknown to people in the area.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#34
From what I understand (and I'm no expert in HFT or electric engineering), this kind of sub-second trading is done in very specific corridors: Chicago-NY, NY-London, London-Frankfurt, London-Paris, Paris-Frankfurt. I wonder if the same applies in Asia, with Singapore, HK, Tokyo, Sidney...

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#35
post #23
post #19

Weirdest thing I've read in a long while. The Author's comments refer to an internet forum thread[0] in German which discusses a German news article from this April.[1]However, it turns out this article is an April Fools text. Just digging deeper into the whole blog you can find something that can only be described as a fanfiction representation of "Flashboys", but in the context of this "Shortwave trading".[2] Is th…

Seems like it is real: https://www.six-group.com/en/home/media/releases/2018/201805...

Yeah it started in Chicago. At my old shop we had a semi-exclusive for Toronto - Chicago route which is used for ETF market making.

The main issue is that the network has a lot of packet loss due to weather condititions.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#36

"Garden Leave" is a paid non-compete time (often a year) used in the financial industry when someone switched jobs. The prior employer invokes it at their option.

That's not always correct. It can be shorter (3 months are common in London) and is often a fixed part of your contract (notice period). If both agree you can shorten it but it's not just invoked at the discretion of your employer.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#37

"Garden Leave" is a paid non-compete time (often a year) used in the financial industry when someone switched jobs. The prior employer invokes it at their option.

I wasn't aware that "paid non-compete" is a thing, thanks for clarifying it. Next time when I see a non-compete in a contract (which is usual for developers), instead of negotiating it out, I'll try to negotiate something like this. What do these agreements usually look like?

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#38
post #6

Given the limitations of such a medium I wonder if the TCP/IP stack is still viable or another transport protocol is used.

I can't imagine they'd need the TCP/IP stack. You might do better with something like: SOH EOH STX ETX CRC EOT Then the receiver would send an ACK or NACK. Repeat as necessary.

Would you even acknowledge? The data is worthless after one round-trip, so you wouldn't send it twice. The receiver just needs to make sure that they read information correctly and can deal with losses.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#39
post #19

Weirdest thing I've read in a long while. The Author's comments refer to an internet forum thread[0] in German which discusses a German news article from this April.[1]However, it turns out this article is an April Fools text. Just digging deeper into the whole blog you can find something that can only be described as a fanfiction representation of "Flashboys", but in the context of this "Shortwave trading".[2] Is th…

Long-time "sniper in mahwah" follower here. The author is without the slightest doubt an elite tech reporter with in-depth understanding of RF tech. He always provides an overwhelming body of evidence to back his writing.

Re: Shortwave Trading: The West Chicago Tower Mystery

#40
post #2

I guess low bandwidth is no problem. You only need to send a stream of price changes of the most common instruments (currencies, stocks). And only if there are meaningful movements. I guess a few kbit/s can already provide a lot of value. How fast would such a connection be? Is there an easy way to calculate the distance the signal takes compared to great circle line?

It may well be signals going over the stream... or significant movements only.
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