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Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

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Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#41
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And welcome to why self-driving cars will always be 3 years away. It's also possible that human/pedestrian behavior will adapt to the consistent behavior of driverless cars.

Or jaywalking will become more strictly enforced with policing or physical barriers. https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2018/4/2/automated-vehic...

[deleted]

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#42
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That, and the inattentive safety driver. It's quite infuriating really, letting lose a ton and a half of fast-moving mass without even the decency of looking where it's going. There's really no excuse.

Unfortunately I think it's one of those things that is both inexcusable and guaranteed to happen. It absolutely makes sense to put a human in a car you're testing and don't have full confidence in yet but are sending into real traffic. Not doing so would be ludicrously negligent. However, humans simply don't maintain focus for a long period of time without some sort of extreme, years-long training. The ability of mon…

I think there's some room for improvement though. Instead of "just one human in there", they could put them out in teams of two, and have periodic "awareness checks" that you have to respond to by pressing a driving-irrelevant button.

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#43

I'm curious what degree of "cultural context" is built into automated cars - I feel that there has to be a lot of locale-specific techniques for driving. For example, in NYC, there's nothing at all uncommon about a pedestrian beginning to cross the street in front of you and approaching the area of your lane where you will shortly be. Pedestrians typically then stop about a foot away from your lane, let you drive pas…

And welcome to why self-driving cars will always be 3 years away. I think we should be targeting self driving for long-haul freeway scenarios where the rules are relatively simple and predictable. Trying to control for the infinite number of scenarios in cities is a nightmare which will ultimately bog down the development of any company which makes that its goal.

This is already happening in the trucking industry. Self-driving trucks are being developed to be able to drive 99% of the trip that's on highways and then human drivers take over for the local 1%. To make it easier, transfer hubs are being built near cities off major highways to make everything easier and non-disruptive. The same thing could be done with cars without the need for the transfer hubs and it basically is already done.

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#44

I'm curious what degree of "cultural context" is built into automated cars - I feel that there has to be a lot of locale-specific techniques for driving. For example, in NYC, there's nothing at all uncommon about a pedestrian beginning to cross the street in front of you and approaching the area of your lane where you will shortly be. Pedestrians typically then stop about a foot away from your lane, let you drive pas…

> But it seems like a very non-trivial problem to do this correctly. I had this same thought. You could theoretically have a universal rule where the self-driving car stops 100% of the time if it detects an object that is determined to be a pedestrian. But there are unforeseen problems with this approach. What if the model is overly cautious and there are many false positives? That could be extremely dangerous too, i…

Stopping is only one option slowing down is another.

However, I suspect a car may be aware a person has stopped significantly before a person would enter their lane. At 30 mph a car takes ~2 seconds to physically brake and at an average walking speed a mph moves 9 feet in 2 seconds. However, to stop before entering the cars lane they would need to start slowing down even sooner.

So, I guess you really need videos with calculated velocities of people jaywalking to really tell if this is going to be a problem or not.

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#45
post #14

The question I want to know is: Did Uber doctor the camera video to make the road seem darker than it actually was? If you recall, there was initially a doubt that Uber was at fault because the streets appeared extremely dark, but I think they were buying time to delay the outage at incompetent Uber. The police initially didn't fault Uber based on this video.

I can recall thinking the video was very bad quality. To the point where I was questioning if the video was from some dashcam they installed instead of the self driving car tech.

The video was from a cheap dashcam, not any of the sensors the car uses. The LIDAR would have seen it clearly. So would your eyes, which have wider dynamic range than any but the best cameras.

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#46
post #14

The question I want to know is: Did Uber doctor the camera video to make the road seem darker than it actually was? If you recall, there was initially a doubt that Uber was at fault because the streets appeared extremely dark, but I think they were buying time to delay the outage at incompetent Uber. The police initially didn't fault Uber based on this video.

I can recall thinking the video was very bad quality. To the point where I was questioning if the video was from some dashcam they installed instead of the self driving car tech.

That was just a dashcam, not the vehicle sensors. NTSB reported that.

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#48
It seems like it was actually Uber who disabled the safety settings that were there to prevent this according to Volvo. "Uber Technologies Inc. disabled the standard collision-avoidance technology in the Volvo SUV that struck and killed a woman in Arizona last week, according to the auto-parts maker that supplied the vehicle’s radar and camera."

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-26/uber-disa...

Re: Uber vehicle reportedly saw but ignored woman it struck

#50

I'm curious what degree of "cultural context" is built into automated cars - I feel that there has to be a lot of locale-specific techniques for driving. For example, in NYC, there's nothing at all uncommon about a pedestrian beginning to cross the street in front of you and approaching the area of your lane where you will shortly be. Pedestrians typically then stop about a foot away from your lane, let you drive pas…

Not related to the article but I want to chime in on your point. Having spent some time in VA, aggressive driving and dangerous scenarios were infrequent from my experience. Then having spent some time in FL, aggressive driving was the norm and driving laws did not exist for most people. So I wonder, do self-driving cars needs something like driving profiles for certain regions, where defensive/aggressive response be…

exactly, act according to context. driving in SF is totally different from nearby places like Lakeshore or San Leandro (people from those places complain about how bad people drive in SF)
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