Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique • Hacker News Board

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#111

Post by trixie_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:16 PM UTC

s73v3r_ wrote: post #73

trixie_ wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin has tons of intrinsic value unique to crypto currencies that traditional currencies lack. Most importantly it can't be created/destroyed at will by a central government. Huge sums can be transferred globally at the speed of light with very low fees. Can't do that with gold or cash. With normal currency a wire transfer costs money and moving a lot of money from a bank account usually takes days. Also you can s…

"Most importantly it can't be created/destroyed at will by a central government." This is not cut and dry as to whether it is a benefit or not. Many people, myself included, don't consider it a benefit. Not having control over your currency makes it that much harder to respond in times of recession. Greece was hit quite hard by the Great Recession, and one of the reasons why is because they didn't have control over t…

You put your trust in governments to not mess with the currency. That's on you. When shit hits the fan people buy gold, it's no different with crypto. People don't trust the government to manage currency correctly in times of trouble. But even in good times, crypto has a lot going for it.

Transactions are very fast and very low compared to traditional currency. Often it takes days to move money between banks, or will cost you much more than a bitcoin transaction fee to move faster.

Again, bitcoin could have 100x the users and the power requirements would be negligible compared to banking. There is no 'scale up' power wise needed for bitcoin.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#112

Post by nkrisc » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:17 PM UTC

mcguire wrote: post #51

sizzzzlerz wrote: post #29

Buffet's investing strategy is, and has always been, look for the intrinsic value in a company, buy them, and then hold on forever. As part of that intrinsic value is the management teams that are running the companies. A strong team is as valuable as any other asset. When Buffet does buy a company, he'll generally leave management in place and not interfere in the day to day running of the company. Bitcoin has no ma…

Further, when you buy a part of a company, you are buying a piece of a functioning economic unit. When you loan money, you are finding economic activity. When you buy a Bitcoin, you are helping to convert electricity to heat.

Think of them as shares of entropy.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#113

Post by s73v3r_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:18 PM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #8

Buffett/Munger have always argued that Gold and other commodities are equally worthless investments based on fear and ponzi like attributes[1]. No surprise then they feel even worse about Bitcoin. The interesting thing here is that the common response here is: "Hey that's a great theory, but in real life, I just paid off my mortgage with my proceeds from bitcoin." While perhaps true, such rebuttals ignore the argumen…

"The interesting thing here is that the common response here is: "Hey that's a great theory, but in real life, I just paid off my mortgage with my proceeds from bitcoin.""

Weren't there a bunch of people who went in debt recently to buy BTC when it was close to $20k?

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#114

Post by 45h34jh53k4j » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:19 PM UTC

piracy1 wrote: post #88

mcguire wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Further, when you buy a part of a company, you are buying a piece of a functioning economic unit. When you loan money, you are finding economic activity. When you buy a Bitcoin, you are helping to convert electricity to heat.

Electricity into security

energy into money. We always wanted a universal energy based currency -- it is bitcoin.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#115

Post by s73v3r_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:19 PM UTC

serg_chernata wrote: post #11

tomdell wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All right, then - how is it productive?

Seeking ways to improve existing systems, financial or not, is a productive activity in my book. How successful the effort is, is another discussion entirely.

I think the question then, is Bitcoin doing that. And whether it is or not varies from person to person.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#116

Post by s73v3r_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:20 PM UTC

brosirmandude wrote: post #15

tomdell wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All right, then - how is it productive?

It depends on your definition of productive but in my opinion it's creating wealth, companies, & jobs. People are going into work every day to work on crypto-related products. Bitcoin & other cryptocurrencies are putting food on the table for those people.

People are doing the same for the IRS scams that pop up around tax time, too.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#117

Post by solean » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:21 PM UTC

ashoon wrote: post #7

internetman55 wrote: post #2

I can't agree or disagree on any investment recommendations as I have no expertise in the area, but I have that is pretty much what my gut reaction to Bitcoin/crypto has always been

As I've learned a bit about blockchain, I feel cryptocurrency is distracting from the broader implications of the technology. It's going to be hard enough for non-technical users to see the underlying value of immutable, distributed data and applications, so that conflation is unfortunate.

Blockchain without Bitcoin is not an innovation. How do you incentivize people to secure the network?

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#118

Post by asdsa5325 » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:21 PM UTC

crasch4 wrote: post #38

Buffett should follow his own advice, and stick to commenting on things that he understands.

He seems to understand intrinsic value pretty well.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#119

Post by s73v3r_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:21 PM UTC

hapnin wrote: post #97

s73v3r_ wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't find it wise for anyone, Buffett or otherwise, to expound on things they don't know anything about." He's talking about investment vehicles. I would say he knows more about those than most of us here on this board.

Everyone that listened to him 20 years ago missed Amazon, Google, etc.

Yes, they had a couple of misses. But I'd say his hits have more than made up for it.

Re: Buffett bashes Bitcoin as nonproductive, thriving on mystique

#120

Post by trixie_ » Mon, May 07, 2018, 4:22 PM UTC

lolsal wrote: post #96

trixie_ wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin has tons of intrinsic value unique to crypto currencies that traditional currencies lack. Most importantly it can't be created/destroyed at will by a central government. Huge sums can be transferred globally at the speed of light with very low fees. Can't do that with gold or cash. With normal currency a wire transfer costs money and moving a lot of money from a bank account usually takes days. Also you can s…

I am largely ignorant to the details of BTC and other coins, but your comment seems incorrect. > Most importantly it can't be created/destroyed at will by a central government. Couldn't someone destroy/steal my BTC wallet though? I'd have no recourse for justice, right? Also, doesn't the Federal Reserve print money mostly at will? > Huge sums can be transferred globally at the speed of light with very low fees. I thi…

The gov can't print bitcoin. Transaction fees are much less than traditional currency, and much faster transfer. (Sorry for not being super exact) Wiring 20k into an exchange costs me $20, a normal transfer takes a few days. Crypto is way more useful to me for moving lots of $$ around.