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Hello Qt for Python

blog.qt.io

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91–100 of 176 posts

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#91

Post by figgis »

stavros wrote: post #66
mherrmann wrote: post #16

Very happy to hear this as the author of a PyQt-based file manager [1] and an open source library for solving the many headaches that come with developing desktop apps [2]. Once Qt for Python is stable enough, I'll be happy to switch to it from PyQt. [1]: https://fman.io [2]: https://github.com/mherrmann/fbs

What would you recommend to someone who wants to write Python desktop applications today? I've used wxWindows way back when, and I'd hate to use Electron. Would you go with Qt for Python, or PyQT? Also, what's PySide/PySide2?

PySide is Qt4. PySide2 is Qt5. I would suggest using PySide2 but using https://github.com/mottosso/Qt.py in case you need to switch to PyQt5 for any reason.

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#92

Post by mixmastamyk »

jimnotgym wrote: post #84
toyg wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My Python head says this should look like this No, that's not "your python head", sorry, that's your "VB head" at best. That's lack of knowledge of how desktop GUI paradigms actually work and what an event loop is and how it interacts with threads. I do not disagree that VB (and Delphi) did a better job at hiding these concepts from the "just getting it done" crowd, but don't blame it on Python if you don't have a…

> but don't blame it on Python if you don't have a grasp of how C++ GUI toolkits actually work. I'm not blaming it on Python, honestly. I'm just really surprised that there isn't a framework that will hide that stuff from me like VB did. You are a 100% correct in that I don't know anything about desktop GUI paradigms, or C++ GUI toolkits. I really don't have the bandwidth to find out either! I'm also surprised that I…

Yes, a shame that the FLOSS world never came up with a competitive integrated VB/Delphi clone in a better language like Python. Probably it would have been a huge undertaking, right when web dev was taking off.

Although I've heard good things about Lazarus IDE, probably your best bet for such projects. Pascal is not hard to learn, or re-learn.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazarus_(IDE)

http://www.lazarus-ide.org/

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#93

Post by StavrosK »

smnrchrds wrote: post #78

Is is possible to use QML in a PyQt/PySide2 app? Using QML for interface and Python for logic would make perfect sense. But every PyQt article and tutorial I see is about QtWidgets.

Do you need PySide2 to support QML in order to use the Qt Designer?

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#94

Post by markroseman »

jimnotgym wrote: post #38
blattimwind wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can't express what's wrong it will be even harder to find a solution.

Sorry, I thought it was generally accepted that Python's relationship with the GUI was troubled? Put in plain English it is like this. I write quite a lot of code that integrates various enterprise systems together. Things like EDI management, and 'brokers' between incompatible API's. It is usually a mixture of Python/Bash/SQL. It is not my full-time job to code, but I get things done. As complexity increased I learn…

And doing your GUI with Tkinter, which has an API that fits incredibly well with Python is a problem because...?

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#95

Post by jimnotgym »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #92
jimnotgym wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but don't blame it on Python if you don't have a grasp of how C++ GUI toolkits actually work. I'm not blaming it on Python, honestly. I'm just really surprised that there isn't a framework that will hide that stuff from me like VB did. You are a 100% correct in that I don't know anything about desktop GUI paradigms, or C++ GUI toolkits. I really don't have the bandwidth to find out either! I'm also surprised that I…

Yes, a shame that the FLOSS world never came up with a competitive integrated VB/Delphi clone in a better language like Python. Probably it would have been a huge undertaking, right when web dev was taking off. Although I've heard good things about Lazarus IDE, probably your best bet for such projects. Pascal is not hard to learn, or re-learn. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazarus_(IDE) http://www.lazarus-ide.org/

As I said I am not qualified to judge how hard this is, but:

I don't really like working in an IDE, or need to. I am happy to design GUI components in a markup language, for the kind of use cases I am talking about.

However would it not be possible to hide the complexities of managing a GUI in the framework/bindings so that the Python user just has to deal with "Someone clicked OK>Run this function" in as easy a way as VB did?

I mean I don't know much about how to send a http request in C++, but I can do it in 'requests' without much problem!

Thanks for the advice on Lazarus. Not FOSS and not desktop, but I have been looking at Anvil recently, which makes it really easy to code web app front ends, allowing me to concentrate on backend stuff.

http://www.anvil.works

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#96

Post by toopsss »

jcelerier wrote: post #28
bitL wrote: post #25

Sadly, we still don't have the seamless UI building functionality Delphi had 15 years ago, allowing making a fairly advanced desktop app in a day. Jumping between Qt Designer and IDE back and forth is still an order of magnitude more complicated than it needs to be.

> Jumping between Qt Designer and IDE back and forth is still an order of magnitude more complicated than it needs to be. ... uh ? the designer is part of the ide... nowadays you even have a code view synced with the UI editor in realtime ( http://blog.qt.io/blog/2017/05/24/qt-quick-designer-qt-creat... )

Ie you have to use qt designer as you ide or switch between IntelliJ/pycharm. It’s not ideal as IntelliJ is miles ahead of qt designer as a general purpose ide for python. I’m pretty spoiled at this point by the excellent refactorings and type support.

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#97

Post by mkl »

toyg wrote: post #57
std_throwaway wrote: post #8

This seems to be the successor for PySide that supports Qt 5. The old PySide died some years ago and only PyQt was offering Qt 5 support. Due to some details PyQt was never officially supported by Qt. Is PySide2 now officially supported by Qt?

Yes, but tbh even PySide was originally "officially supported" by Qt, when Nokia owned it; and then it was dropped. So the question is whether it will continue to be supported. The owners of PyQt (Riverbank) depend on that product to survive; whereas Qt has bigger fish to fry most of the time. The incentives are very different.

It wasn't so much that PySide was dropped, as the whole of Qt was dropped (by Nokia). PySide development was funded by Nokia, which owned Qt, and done mostly in a Nokia R&D institute in Brazil (INdT). Nokia sold Qt to Digia, and Microsoft bought Nokia, so there was no connection anymore between Qt and the people who developed PySide, and so it stalled.

Digia later spun off The Qt Company, which develops Qt and is now developing PySide2, so this is actually the first time the same organisation has developed both Qt and Python bindings for it.

For many purposes (including mine), PyQt is very expensive, so I'm really hoping PySide2 goes somewhere.

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#98

Post by mixmastamyk »

jimnotgym wrote: post #95
mixmastamyk wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, a shame that the FLOSS world never came up with a competitive integrated VB/Delphi clone in a better language like Python. Probably it would have been a huge undertaking, right when web dev was taking off. Although I've heard good things about Lazarus IDE, probably your best bet for such projects. Pascal is not hard to learn, or re-learn. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazarus_(IDE) http://www.lazarus-ide.org/

As I said I am not qualified to judge how hard this is, but: I don't really like working in an IDE, or need to. I am happy to design GUI components in a markup language, for the kind of use cases I am talking about. However would it not be possible to hide the complexities of managing a GUI in the framework/bindings so that the Python user just has to deal with "Someone clicked OK>Run this function" in as easy a way…

VB was easy because of shortcuts provided by the IDE.

If you don't want one, QML is what you are looking for.

Saw anvil and it looked interesting, aren't apps tied to its system however?

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#99

Post by jimnotgym »

markroseman wrote: post #94
jimnotgym wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I thought it was generally accepted that Python's relationship with the GUI was troubled? Put in plain English it is like this. I write quite a lot of code that integrates various enterprise systems together. Things like EDI management, and 'brokers' between incompatible API's. It is usually a mixture of Python/Bash/SQL. It is not my full-time job to code, but I get things done. As complexity increased I learn…

And doing your GUI with Tkinter, which has an API that fits incredibly well with Python is a problem because...?

I'm really pleased to hear you say that. Every time I have asked about Tkinter on here or SO I get "Tk is really old, you should be using Qt or blahblah". So I guess I start to doubt myself and think that the issues I am having are because I am such a noob I used this crappy old framework that no serious developer would.

However I still find similar issues with Tkinter as I discussed above, I really didn't expect to have to learn how Tk event loops or whatever worked just to get my code to execute in the order it is written in! I guess I was just naive.

Re: Hello Qt for Python

#100

Post by lbeltrame »

I skimmed through the posts in the thread but no one seemed to mention the major pet peeve that (IMO) PyQt has, which is not the licensing, but the development model:

1. SIP files are generated and dropped into the tarball: no way to do that yourself (the tool is available, but completely undocumented). This is problematic when a new major Qt version is out, but PyQt hasn't updated yet (I had problems like this recently when building PyQt5 for Qt 5.11 for openSUSE)

2. There is absolutely no bug reporting: you have to join the mailing list, post about your issue, and hopefully get an answer or "fixed in next snapshot" (see below)

3. There's no source repository access, just frequently-released "snapshots". Backporting patches to stable releases (because perhaps fixes aren't in old versions) is a chore.

4. Submitting patches as well requires a ML post: not bad per se, but there's no real workflow for it (and hard to do anyway without having the current state of the code).

I don't have to use PyQt professionally (all my stuff is parsing/querying/stats, so a GUI isn't necessary), but for my free time projects I preferred to learn C++ and Qt than go through PyQt again. And it's a shame since the bindings are quite good in quality.

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