Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

181–190 of 360 posts

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#181

Post by jMyles »

contourtrails wrote: post #160
jMyles wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say total slaves vs. total prisoners - I said black men. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/12/michelle-alexander... edit: I can't imagine why I'm being downvoted here. My statement was utterly correct, and when challenged I cited a credible source. What'd I do wrong?!

They broke laws and are being punished as criminals. Many people of all races are punished in the same way. I think drug laws in this country are way too harsh, but those are the laws. People should not break them if they don't want to be jailed. Also slavery was a human problem for thousands of years, it took humanity collectively waking up to the evils of slavery to abolish it. Human governments the world over supp…

Come on now. What are you even talking about?

> People should not break them if they don't want to be jailed.

I'm white. That means I can smoke as much herb as I want and not even dream of entering the criminal justice system unless I'm extraordinarily unlucky. Moreover, I don't give a flying fuck what some politician in Washington has to say about my diet. I don't base what I put into my body on bad laws.

But if you are black, you have a much more difficult decision to make.

> now they've evolved. Don't judge them today based on the mistakes of the past.

If drug prohibition is the "evolved" form, then we still have a long way to go. That's the point.

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#182

Post by sterlind »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #166
sterlind wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"In the telcos, singlemode fiber is used to connect long distance switches, central offices and SLCs (subscriber loop carriers, small switches in pedestals in subdivisions or office parks or in the basement of a larger building). Practically every telco's network is now fiber optics except the connection to the home." [1] Specifically, AT&T has transitioned its PSTN backbone fully to SIP, which is a form of VoIP: "AT…

According to Snowden's documents, the NSA isn't collecting all data out of Room 641A, just data sent to or from specific foreign targets with surveillance court orders, contradicting your claim.

Could you provide a source for your claim? You can read about TEMPORA here [1], which contradicts you:

"We keep the full sessions for 3 working days and the metadata for 30."

The filtering you're talking about would happen in POKERFACE, which applies after intake into TEMPORA. Basically:

Backhaul -> TEMPORA (3 day buffer) -> POKERFACE (scrubs data by policy such as US citizen status) -> XKeyscore

1. http://www.spiegel.de/media/media-34103.pdf

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#183

Post by MertsA »

jlgaddis wrote: post #82

500M in all of 2017? Oh, come on! We found out that Verizon -- just Verizon -- was handing over "phone records of millions of Verizon customers daily" in June 2013. 500M might be an official number that they're willing to release but (without any way to prove it, obviously) I'm certain that the REAL number is much, much higher. For an organization who has vowed to "collect it all", it just doesn't seem likely that th…

>Or perhaps it's just 500M according to their own made up definition of "collect"?

This sounds like it's much closer to the truth. "It's not a collection until it comes up as a result in a search" would be about on par with the nonsense the NSA was claiming about what was considered searching data on American Citizens.

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#184

Post by basicplus2 »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #144
mk89 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The concept of prison the way we intend it is relatively new (let's say a couple of hundred years). So I am not surprised to see that there are still some references to slavery here and there, because that was actually the punishment back then. The reason we have more blacks than white in prison is for dozens reasons: - legacy - cultural differences - social injustice Etc. Don't solve problems, ignore them, expect th…

This should be downvoted to oblivion. The only folks I've ever heard say black people's (we're not "blacks" BTW, we are actually people) problems are attributable to our culture ate racist shitbags. In order to believe that black people have some intrinsic culture of self destruction one would have to believe that culture evolves in some sort of vacuum. This couldn't be further from the truth when talking about Afric…

I had to look it up..

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_economy

And in doing so I read this bit about "it may have had as much to do with spreading poverty around"

I presume that white people no longer having the black people to live off meant

A. white people had to do alot more work themselves, and

B. white people had to share much more of the available resources with black people

So that they actively participated in racism to keep more resources for themselves..

Is this a reasonable take on this?

This is the part from the Wikipedia cited above I am referring to..

"However, the African American struggle to earn economic parity, that had made progress during the first half century of the postbellum era, had largely been reversed during the second half. Legally, equality was assured, but that did little to actually promulgate equal conditions in daily life.

Some of the gains in the South's economic relation to the rest of the U.S. can be explained by population shifts to other regions; so, it may have had as much to do with spreading poverty around, as spreading wealth around."

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#185

Post by tompitt123 »

jlgaddis wrote: post #82

500M in all of 2017? Oh, come on! We found out that Verizon -- just Verizon -- was handing over "phone records of millions of Verizon customers daily" in June 2013. 500M might be an official number that they're willing to release but (without any way to prove it, obviously) I'm certain that the REAL number is much, much higher. For an organization who has vowed to "collect it all", it just doesn't seem likely that th…

NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017?

I think it's more than 500M

by the way, you have child? let play game with them. http://rolltheball.co/

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#186

Post by contourtrails »

jMyles wrote: post #181
contourtrails wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They broke laws and are being punished as criminals. Many people of all races are punished in the same way. I think drug laws in this country are way too harsh, but those are the laws. People should not break them if they don't want to be jailed. Also slavery was a human problem for thousands of years, it took humanity collectively waking up to the evils of slavery to abolish it. Human governments the world over supp…

Come on now. What are you even talking about? > People should not break them if they don't want to be jailed. I'm white. That means I can smoke as much herb as I want and not even dream of entering the criminal justice system unless I'm extraordinarily unlucky. Moreover, I don't give a flying fuck what some politician in Washington has to say about my diet. I don't base what I put into my body on bad laws. But if you…

I'm with you, prohibition of weed is very backwards. But that's hardly slavery.

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#187

Post by JustSomeNobody »

anoncoward778 wrote: post #17

Automatically collecting everyone's cell phone data, has software automatically installed in Smart TV's everywhere, monitors your online footprint (emails, social media[of course]). All those warning from Snowden all those secret software reveals from wikileaks an untold amount of funding from congress with virtually no oversight. And yet tons of bad things keep happening to regular citizens in the US. What exactly d…

> And yet tons of bad things keep happening to regular citizens in the US.

The "War on Terror!"[0] is yet another way to funnel money to rich corporations. It is a money making machine and that's really all it is. More people die from choking in the U.S. each year than died from terrorism in at least the past 5 years. And yet, we've spent 100's of billions. The NSA is just a piece of that machine.

[0] I know you were being more general in your comment, I'm just pointing out a single reason.

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#188

Post by newman8r »

jMyles wrote: post #177
newman8r wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article makes the claim for the year 1850, and your claim is for the year 1860. There were more slaves in 1860 ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1860_United_States_Census ) than in 1850 ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1850_United_States_Census ) In 1860 there were 3,953,761 slaves counted in the census. In 2016, if you count everyone under probation and parole in addition to those in jail and prison, the number is…

Yep, you're right - I was off by a decade. I initially heard about this not from The New Jim Crow but from this (seemingly awesome) Brown University student: http://www.politifact.com/rhode-island/statements/2014/dec/0... ...but if I'm doing the math correctly, it appears to hold even for 1860 for adult males.

Actually I see now that you specifically said 'black men', which is a different statistic, so I think you might be correct.

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#189

Post by jhpankow »

tompitt123 wrote: post #185
jlgaddis wrote: post #82

500M in all of 2017? Oh, come on! We found out that Verizon -- just Verizon -- was handing over "phone records of millions of Verizon customers daily" in June 2013. 500M might be an official number that they're willing to release but (without any way to prove it, obviously) I'm certain that the REAL number is much, much higher. For an organization who has vowed to "collect it all", it just doesn't seem likely that th…

NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017? I think it's more than 500M by the way, you have child? let play game with them. http://rolltheball.co/

is this spam?

Re: NSA collected 500M U.S. call records in 2017, a sharp rise: official report

#190

Post by damon_c »

jMyles wrote: post #115
mk89 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your comment is meant to be sarcastic, then I am failing to see it... Could you explain what you mean by enslaving as prisoner? So you would let a rapist free or what?

No no, I'm just pointing out that the 13th amendment to the Constitution didn't outlaw slavery entirely, but instead a clause literally beginning with the word "except" - can you imagine? "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except ..." It's candor and obfuscation at the very same time. Here's the rest of the text: "...as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist with…

One of the most ridiculous manifestations of this is at this prison called "Angola" in Louisiana which is literally built on a cotton field and has forced prisoners to pick cotton since around 1880.

https://mic.com/articles/88461/a-modern-day-slave-plantation...

edit: another link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_State_Penitentiary

Post reply on HN