The rise of the pointless job • Hacker News Board

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#261

Post by Maybestring » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:09 PM UTC

leetcrew wrote: post #135

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I talk to people about changing the world so work is optional, and people are really attached to the idea that everyone should work all the time. Our world is sufficiently productive (a trend I expect to continue rising) that we could offer a modest life to everyone regardless of how much they work. Or more conservatively, we could build a world where everyone has 8 weeks of vacation a year or could take 6 months off…

> Our world is sufficiently productive (a trend I expect to continue rising) that we could offer a modest life to everyone regardless of how much they work. i realize that the rest of your post details technological advancements that could create this condition (on an indefinite timeline), but you also seem to be saying that it is already possible today. i often see this sort of claim these days, and i always wonder…

This would be such a massive change to the world economy that I'm not sure present day prices for anything are even relevant.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#262

Post by seattle_spring » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:09 PM UTC

optimusmaximus wrote: post #233

Filligree wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do. Wars. Wars are worse.

>muh war is bad, you guys. amirite? >muh humanity Judaeo-Christian bullshit. Words can't describe how hard I'm rolling my eyes right now.

Well you sure convinced me, champ.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#263

Post by ouid » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:23 PM UTC

jopsen wrote: post #256

WJW wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is visited the USA just once (in 2003), but there was an old man that took my bag off the end of the luggage belt at the airport and handed it to me. I could easily have picked it up myself, but he was there for those 30 centimeters of bag travel. I remember being amazed about it and remarking the pointlessness of that job to my coworkers.

In the US you often see people holding a sign saying "slow" next to construction or road work. This is a job that could literally be automated with a pole :)

Those signs say stop on the other side and are used in conjuction with someone on the other end of the construction holding up the opposite sign so that a single lane can be used to handle traffic in two directions. That job would need to be automated with a traffic light.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#264

Post by ausvisaissues » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:29 PM UTC

foamflower wrote: post #83

lainga wrote: post #15

I have said this before, but I see some parallels between the modern world and Japan during the early Tokugawa era. Japan had pretty much reached a steady state by the time Tokugawa Iyeyasu came to power in 1600; most of the available land had been cultivated or settled, and, especially after the policies of Toyotomi Hideyoshi, society was locked in a rigid structure without much room for advancement or unrest. As a…

When my family lived in Japan years ago, we noticed that when taking the train, approximately three attendants checked our tickets before we boarded a train. At least two of those jobs are "bullshit" in terms of producing wealth, but they are socially beneficial in a culture where the social contract requires near-zero unemployment. (I, apparently like you, can't help but remember this kind of arrangement when listen…

Most gates are automatic now in Japan (with a conductor sometimes checking tickets on Shinkansen after gates).

When I was in the US there was a guy handing me a towel in the bathroom. That is an incredibly meaningless and superfluous job!

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#265

Post by marcosdumay » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:33 PM UTC

ouid wrote: post #263

jopsen wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US you often see people holding a sign saying "slow" next to construction or road work. This is a job that could literally be automated with a pole :)

Those signs say stop on the other side and are used in conjuction with someone on the other end of the construction holding up the opposite sign so that a single lane can be used to handle traffic in two directions. That job would need to be automated with a traffic light.

A smart traffic light that can count how any cars enter and exit the zone. It's perfectly possible to automate, but it may not be the best ROI around.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#266

Post by duderific » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:34 PM UTC

pbrb wrote: post #227

askafriend wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get that comp as a senior engineer at any decent large company or any of the FANG companies.

I guess I'll have to brush up on whiteboard interviews. It just seems goofy that 350k is normal! I'm a sr engineer in chicago, and thought there was no way I could command the salary needed to make COL worth it.

I think that's far from normal...if you look at any board of average senior level engineering salaries, even in Silicon Valley and even at the FAANG companies, it's nowhere near that.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#267

Post by exolymph » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:34 PM UTC

edraferi wrote: post #239

modbait wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Through my long career, I've notice virtually no correlation between my pay and the utility of my position. And indeed, I've had one or two jobs like yours. Sadly for my bank book, I can only stand being useless for relatively short stretches. I still reminisce about my lowest paying job, my first. It was probably the most enjoyable and satisfying. It was also useful, though perhaps not at the top of that list. It's…

There's an economic theory that job satisfaction is a kind of compensation. That is, you have to pay people more to do unsatisfying jobs.

This is just a form of supply and demand. More people want to do $desirable_job or $satisfying_job (and there's plenty of overlap), so you don't have to pay them as much, because there's always another person in line to take the position.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#268

Post by duderific » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:37 PM UTC

trophycase wrote: post #94

smm2000 wrote: post #76

Author lost me on doorman. Doormen absolutely bring value and saying that doormen is bullshit job is the same as saying that waitress is a bullshit job - in the end customer is fully capable of bringing the food from the counter to his table on his own. Doormen Can accept packages when you are not in your apt (leaving outside is not an option in NY) Can accept laundry delivery Provide security by screening people out…

Right. The real useless jobs are the 10 people working on animating hair for the next Assassin's Creed game or the CGI for the next Marvel film

There are probably more like 50 people working on animating the hair. But yeah, your point is well taken.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#269

Post by nwatson » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:57 PM UTC

chongli wrote: post #255

peterwwillis wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those aren't bullshit either... Who else is going to animate the hair? If there's a robot that can do the job, great, but it has to get done somehow.

No it doesn't. Marvel movies could stop existing tomorrow and it wouldn't matter at all. Life goes on.

Getting paid to satisfy others' frivolous pursuits is the future of work. With more real-world work being automated away, we'd better hope there are jobs like "World of Warcraft Concierge" and "Sim City Colorist." All the "honest day's labor" jobs are evaporating.

Re: The rise of the pointless job

#270

Post by PhasmaFelis » Fri, May 04, 2018, 11:57 PM UTC

3pt14159 wrote: post #180

poulsbohemian wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very similar to the situation that caused the Swiss to become the mercenaries of Europe. If you were the second son, you weren't going to inherit the farm and thus in a resource-poor country like Switzerland of the Middle Ages, your best choice was to go abroad and find some feudal lord putting together an army. Thus you became a "freelance" and hopefully found riches. I've always thought Machiavelli's dislik…

Eh. They could become merchants or craftspersons too. The options weren't starve to death or kill for money.

It would have been unthinkable, in a lot of history, for a nobleman to become a merchant or a craftsman. Not just "people think you're weird," but like your family and friends would disown you and your potential customers would all think you're insane and you'd have no way to learn the job anyway because no commoner would dare take you as an apprentice. The modern Western world has no analog for how deep the noble/commoner divide was.

Third sons wouldn't starve to death in any case, but they would rattle around the family lands making a nuisance of themselves and borrowing money from Dad. Noble families got some income from their tenants' taxes, generally, but it wasn't always enough to maintain yourself in high style. In some times/places, noblemen could get involved in trade, but that would mean funding other people's endeavors, not becoming merchants themselves. And sometimes even that was restricted or frowned upon.