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Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

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Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#121

Post by __erik »

merinowool wrote: post #109
m-p-3 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering how that salary difference really is when comparing the cost of living of many Canadian cities vs Silicon Valley, the taxation rate and the social services provided (universal healthcare, etc).

Is Canadian healthcare any good? Where I live, you pay for this privilege quite a lot of tax at still you have to go privately, because the quality is just not worth your health. I really wish "universal healthcare" was scrapped, so I could afford better services privately.

Canadian services are typically good especially for urgent care things, I only have gone private on one occasion and that was for an MRI years ago when there were fewer of them available. I had a tear in my MCL and they wanted to see the degree (relatively low priority, it wasn't a full tear and I didnt need surgery). The wait for the MRI was ~6 weeks but so just paid out of pocket privately and had the results sent to my doctor. Took 2 days and he got what he needed.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#122

Post by wk_end »

Kelbit wrote: post #87
guiolo wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Canadian tech companies love to complain about lack of talent, but they're not willing to pay for it [...] They most likely to a large extent can't. It's just a different model both as comapnies and country. In general you can rarely win by being a lesser version of something else. Canada can, hopefully, do a lot of things the US can't. Those are the things it should do to attract people.

I think it's more a case of VCs not being calibrated to the real cost of doing business. Canada is a first world country with a GDP per capita not much less than the states. There is plenty of wealth available that could be invested in tech. It's just Bay Street generally doesn't want to, because they don't understand the tech business. Name one prominent Canadian VC firm - I can't think of any, and I'm Canadian. But…

It's been suggested to me that because of Canada's long history of a resource-based economy, Canadian investors are far more accustomed to the long, slow model of: let's research a site for several years, make sure it'll be profitable, build a town, and get to work. The higher risk, fail-fast nature of VC investing is just too foreign to their business model.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#123

Post by dblohm7 »

okfine wrote: post #112
Kelbit wrote: post #13

If Canadian companies were willing to offer a competitive salary, maybe Canadian grads would stay. It doesn't even have to be 1:1 with the US, even 75% would be nice. As it is, there is little incentive to stay here. I know a new grad who was faced with the choice of staying in Canada to earn $40-50k CAD per year starting, or heading to the US where he had a job offer with one of the big five for $120k USD plus signi…

"If Canadian companies were willing" This comes up in every thread about Canada, but it seems a lapse of logic to anthropomorphize a market like this. The market doesn't "will" anything, and people's willingness to offer/accept a salary is more a consequence of local conditions than a cause. Those conditions include the option of getting paid more if you're willing to leave the country, which some are. Presumably tha…

Well, the Canadian employees are moving south. They clearly aren't accepting it.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#124

Post by DanAndersen »

merinowool wrote: post #113
downrightmike wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hence the "hour of code" and "everyone should code" movements.

Funny times we live in, people think as if this was something like hunting or riding a horse. I wonder if in the history there was a moment where people organised "hour of making baskets" or "everyone should write books"

In times past, skilled professionals were more sensible and had guilds and trade unions to protect their value. It's funny to see how tech megacorps are easily able to subvert programmers' "passion" and "hacker attitude" to promote programs that devalue their labor.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#126

Post by okfine »

dblohm7 wrote: post #123
okfine wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If Canadian companies were willing" This comes up in every thread about Canada, but it seems a lapse of logic to anthropomorphize a market like this. The market doesn't "will" anything, and people's willingness to offer/accept a salary is more a consequence of local conditions than a cause. Those conditions include the option of getting paid more if you're willing to leave the country, which some are. Presumably tha…

Well, the Canadian employees are moving south. They clearly aren't accepting it.

I meant employees of Canadian companies, who by definition are.

(I edited it to say "their employees" instead of "Canadian employees". Hopefully that will help.)

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#127

Post by oligopoly »

ahelwer wrote: post #53

I'm a Canadian software engineer working in Seattle. One time on a flight back to the homeland I sat next to a Canadian tech VC. We spoke about the tech scene in Canada, and eventually she started complaining about how all the good engineers leave for the States. I mentioned my experience with the massive 50% pay gap in software engineer salaries, and she said something about how it was the fault of the exchange rate…

Reading HN you'd expect people shunning US because of Trump, but reality seems to be different. Which isn't surprising since economy is booming and unemployment is in all time low.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#128

Post by dblohm7 »

merinowool wrote: post #109
m-p-3 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering how that salary difference really is when comparing the cost of living of many Canadian cities vs Silicon Valley, the taxation rate and the social services provided (universal healthcare, etc).

Is Canadian healthcare any good? Where I live, you pay for this privilege quite a lot of tax at still you have to go privately, because the quality is just not worth your health. I really wish "universal healthcare" was scrapped, so I could afford better services privately.

It's great, but there can be long wait lists for specialists, even for urgent things.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#129

Post by eruci »

That study means nothing. Canadians will move to Silicon Valley, or work on Silicon Valley projects from here. Governments have little policy leverage on borderless tech companies these days. (Disclosure: I'm a one man Canadian company - geocode.xyz - happily working in Canada although most of my clients are outside of Canada.)

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#130

Post by [deleted] »

m-p-3 wrote: post #17
Kelbit wrote: post #13

If Canadian companies were willing to offer a competitive salary, maybe Canadian grads would stay. It doesn't even have to be 1:1 with the US, even 75% would be nice. As it is, there is little incentive to stay here. I know a new grad who was faced with the choice of staying in Canada to earn $40-50k CAD per year starting, or heading to the US where he had a job offer with one of the big five for $120k USD plus signi…

I'm wondering how that salary difference really is when comparing the cost of living of many Canadian cities vs Silicon Valley, the taxation rate and the social services provided (universal healthcare, etc).

[deleted]
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