Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#221

Post by Nokinside » Thu, May 03, 2018, 6:56 PM UTC

supernovae wrote: post #160

Nokinside wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, this was not some PR event. Musk had large number of people knew what they were talking about wanting to ask tough questions. What Musk is interested in is not relevant. Secondly, Musk can't avoid short term investor questions because unless he answers them, there may be no longer term. This kind of clear avoidance of difficult questions can easily add one percentage point to Tesla's future loans and reduce…

Investing is what we make of it. The reality is for everyone but the top 1%, investing is long term. It's tied into 401ks, it tied into RSU, its tied into Options unless you're the top 1% in which case the only benefit of short-term markets is the ability to manipulate them for your own benefit. Many CEO's know this and Tesla isn't the only company that faces this problem. Amazon has to think long-term, many tech com…

Even long term investing is fundamentally risk management. Tesla has so much debt and burning trough so much money that Tesla has problems with the future.

You want to quantify the risks you are taking. Answering questions would help.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#222

Post by nick_urban » Thu, May 03, 2018, 6:57 PM UTC

Zhenya wrote: post #190

What a weird call. Especially the callout of the diamler CEO. Elon says that the diamler CEO does not understand physics "He doesn't know much about physics. I know him. I'd be happy to engage in a physics discussion with him. I actually studied physics in college." Wiki says otherwise: "... studied electrical engineering from 1971 to 1976 at the University of Karlsruhe; he graduated as an engineer. He completed his…

Engineering students are usually required to study physics.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#223

Post by mikestew » Thu, May 03, 2018, 6:57 PM UTC

haberman wrote: post #132

rtkwe wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really a flamethrower, it's a glorified propane torch with a plastic gun shell, it's a toy. Can't say S&W wouldn't get flak for making something like this given our current climate but it's really not a weapon.

What is the difference between a flamethrower and a propane torch? I find myself inexplicably delighted at the prospect of understanding this distinction.

Depending on the worth of pictures I might save some words here.

Weeney propane torch: http://gigadgetstech.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Organic_...

A real flamethrower: https://flamethrowerplans.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Fla...

Or, as others have already described, one burns a flammable gas and puts out a flame a few inches long. The other squirts flammable liquid at you from a long ways away, then ignites it.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#224

Post by xkjkls » Thu, May 03, 2018, 6:57 PM UTC

mcguire wrote: post #216

xkjkls wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the entertainment sense, sure. But Musk is running a $50 billion company, not performing stand up.

Jim Cramer, though, is.

presses button to make recorded bull sound

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#225

Post by xkjkls » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:00 PM UTC

3pt14159 wrote: post #136

nodesocket wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree about it being embarrassing and cringey. I appreciate his no-bs and no-fluff candor. Elon called out the press for writing misleading articles to generate clicks. He went as far as calling it irresponsible and dangerous. He also called out day-traders, saying of you can't handle volatility then sell your stock. "I am not here to convince you to buy Tesla stock." You can listen to the call at https://edge.med…

Yeah I agree with you nodesocket. Musk comes off as focusing on the right things, not getting bogged down by a x% difference on capital outlay here or there.

Then let his CFO answer the questions. These are important things to shareholders.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#226

Post by tptacek » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:01 PM UTC

nodesocket wrote: post #124

mephitix wrote: post #5

I was on this call. It was extremely cringey/embarrassing to hear Elon dismiss valid questions. At the same time, it was fantastic to see a young, smart, retail investor (Gali from Hyperchange) get to ask so many questions directly to the leadership team. I thought before the call that Gali would get to ask only one question, like the other analysts. He was able to ask almost 10! It was surreal. I was left feeling th…

Disagree about it being embarrassing and cringey. I appreciate his no-bs and no-fluff candor. Elon called out the press for writing misleading articles to generate clicks. He went as far as calling it irresponsible and dangerous. He also called out day-traders, saying of you can't handle volatility then sell your stock. "I am not here to convince you to buy Tesla stock." You can listen to the call at https://edge.med…

Neat! Glad to hear it. Do you have a couple billion dollars Tesla can borrow?

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#227

Post by komali2 » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:02 PM UTC

kc10 wrote: post #122

I have been investing a portion of my paycheck every month for the last three years and never sold TSLA. It's bothering me to see so many high profile departures particularly in finance/accounting groups. And yesterday's conference call was a disaster, I see it as dodging valid questions related to current state of the company and answering open ended interesting questions like "When will Tesla launch its own network…

Nice, helping make it cheaper for us :)

I for one have been loving the dump, makes it real easy to buy.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#228

Post by jacquesm » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:02 PM UTC

pbreit wrote: post #70

kneel wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because he's Elon Musk and he doesn't care about investor returns, he wants to build rockets, cars, tunnels, and explore space. No matter what he does he'll more than likely be fine on the money side.

Guy has been instrumental in a couple hundred billion $$ in market value and you’re suggesting he doesn’t care about investor returns? Wow.

I'm not sure I'm following you. Creating market value and returning money to the investors as an ROI are not the same things. An earnings call is an opportunity to tell shareholders when - and if - they can expect some of their money back by giving them a more complete picture about how the company is doing. It is part of the role of a CEO in a publicly traded company to continue to inspire investor confidence. Value creation is the easy part, value capture the hard part and without that second bit Tesla's stock will implode. So he will have to talk to those investors to address their worries or the stock value will drop rapidly.

A crazy high valuation is no guarantee that a company can not go bust at some point, though in Tesla's case if they run out of money all that will likely happen is that their next round will be one at a lower valuation and with a group of investors that cares less about the short term.

Elon made the decision to play on Wall Street, that decision comes with some responsibilities and it is downright strange to see him literally bite the hand that feeds him. Without the cash he picked up through the IPO Tesla would be in a completely different position. He's made a couple of boneheaded moves (such as rolling Solar City in with Tesla), which have so far been accepted because of the halo and the promises. But there is a limit to how far that will stretch and I'm confused why he would stretch that on purpose if he has other alternatives (such as simply answering the questions). If he doesn't have any answers, which is one way to interpret his refusal, then Tesla is already in trouble.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#229

Post by xkjkls » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:03 PM UTC

lev99 wrote: post #188

tensor wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the sake of society, I hope Musk succeeds. We've spent too much time as a culture celebrating fairly useless achievements and being unwilling to dare to do the things that will truly take us forward.

> We've spent too much time as a culture celebrating fairly useless achievements and being unwilling to dare to do the things that will truly take us forward. Are you kidding? Society had progressed more in the last 10 years than it has in the previous 20, with all indications the next 10 will see even more progress. We are making real progress, even excluding the great work Musk is doing in Solar/EV/Space/Boring/Hyp…

Yeah, the idea that 2008, pre-smartphone, is somehow worse than 2018 post-smartphone seems absurd.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#230

Post by jacquesm » Thu, May 03, 2018, 7:04 PM UTC

greglindahl wrote: post #108

debt wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I concur. The kind of numbers they're talking about are no joke. Investors immediately responded to Elon's hubris in kind by severely punishing the stock. Seems the joke is on Musk.

How did you figure out that the reason the stock fell was this particular one? (Edit: "Elon's hubris" in particular) Stock programs have all kinds of explanations they give out as to why a stock moves. Usually, it's a guess.

Sure, but if the stock starts dropping during an earnings call in after hours trading and drops a whopping 5%+ at the opening of the next session then it is a reasonable assumption that something during the earnings call triggered the sell-off. And they were doing ok right up to the point where Elon stopped answering investors questions.