Live data from Hacker News

The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

thesoundingline.com

51–60 of 145 posts

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#51
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it makes regions with total different population densities appear on the same level It shows unemployment RATES, so population density does not matter.

It does matter. Consider of a hypothetical country consisting of two equally large regions. One region is desert, only 10,000 people live there and unemployment rate is 20%. In the other region there are 1M people and the employment rate is 3%. Now if you look at the map, it seems that the country is doing pretty poorly. Half of the country has a bad employment rate. Whereas in reality it only affect a small portion…

I don't understand what you mean. The map in your hypothetical situation nor this blog post wouldn't misrepresent anything.

It doesn't claim to be a map of 'unemployment rate confounded with population density' in the first place. You've imagined that. It's a map of simply the 'unemployment rate'.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#53
post #36

Two days ago I was watching a German TV show in which the panelists discussed the low-wage-job boom: apparently unemployment is very low (5.6%) but an unhealthy portion of the jobs people are working are low-wage and/or exploitative of labor, and thus not really contributing to long-term social stability. If too many people are working minimum wage and the minimum wage isn't realistic then sooner or later you have a…

Why pay? A much more reasonable solution is to pretend that subtle systemic connections don't exist between all agents in society, and just let them suffer and die.

Sure, long term, that might lead to even bigger problems, but on the other hand, long-term is not NOW.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#54
post #36

Two days ago I was watching a German TV show in which the panelists discussed the low-wage-job boom: apparently unemployment is very low (5.6%) but an unhealthy portion of the jobs people are working are low-wage and/or exploitative of labor, and thus not really contributing to long-term social stability. If too many people are working minimum wage and the minimum wage isn't realistic then sooner or later you have a…

I'm more of an UBI guy. The whole minimum-wage stuff didn't seem like a good idea to me.

But since its conception I only read good things about it.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The definition of "unemployment" is important here. it An unemployed person is defined by Eurostat, according to the guidelines of the International Labour Organization, as: > someone aged 15 to 74 (in Italy, Spain, the United Kingdom, Iceland, Norway: 16 to 74 years); > without work during the reference week; > available to start work within the next two weeks (or has already found a job to start within the next thr…

No - to be on the dole you need to be actively searching for a job in most jurisdictions in Europe. E.g. in the UK you need to go down to the job center every week and prove you're searching for a job in order to claim unemployment benefit. It's literally called jobseeker's allowance to reflect that. Also what is a "government job market program"? Are you referring to a government employing people en masse to inflate…

Reporting from Greece:

1) most unemployed people are not entitled to any kind of allowance. There are big groups of unemployed people (women, people aged 50+, specialized workers eg constructor workers ) who have given up the hope to find a job except from some occasional paydays (most likely black labor) which they may find from word of mouth. They do not bother going to the "job center/unemployment office".

2) The unemployment office arranges for "training" where groups of unemployed people can attend. The attendants are paid like a 100-300e per month for 1-6 months. During these (otherwise useless) trainings these people are no longer considered unemployed and one can read these disgusting news titles "unemployment down to 30% from 31.5%".

I myself was never counted as an unemployed in Greece until I found my first position (in the UK as an engineer mind you... )

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does matter. Consider of a hypothetical country consisting of two equally large regions. One region is desert, only 10,000 people live there and unemployment rate is 20%. In the other region there are 1M people and the employment rate is 3%. Now if you look at the map, it seems that the country is doing pretty poorly. Half of the country has a bad employment rate. Whereas in reality it only affect a small portion…

> One region is desert, only 10,000 people live there > In the other region there are 1M people This has already been normalized: these are European NUTS-2 regions, which are drawn to contain roughly equal populations. Each NUTS-2 region is supposed to be 800k to 3 million people per region. It's not perfect, but it's not just geographical borders with wildly different populations. For example, London is split into 5…

This is important, but I'd still say it's difficult to reason about population size affected in this chart. Its great for showing regional spread and has value, but like most data one visualisation will always prioritise some information over other info. Comparing nations has always been difficult, so I do like that they at least try to show region's proportionate to population.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#58
post #54
post #36

Two days ago I was watching a German TV show in which the panelists discussed the low-wage-job boom: apparently unemployment is very low (5.6%) but an unhealthy portion of the jobs people are working are low-wage and/or exploitative of labor, and thus not really contributing to long-term social stability. If too many people are working minimum wage and the minimum wage isn't realistic then sooner or later you have a…

I'm more of an UBI guy. The whole minimum-wage stuff didn't seem like a good idea to me. But since its conception I only read good things about it.

The crux is that welfare payouts need to be wholly discontinued in order for UBI to make sense -- the intention is that UBI replaces a unmaintainable patchwork with a universal safety net. Having both doesn't make economic sense and only causes confusion and financial pain.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#59
There are groups of people that, through no fault of their own, are less productive. Maybe they are young and inexperienced just out of school, maybe they are older and have lower stamina, maybe they are rooted in a region where it is costlier and more difficult for businesses to operate, maybe they are a visible minority and are made less efficient by other people’s discriminatory treatment, maybe they have a difficult family situation affecting them at work, maybe they only have experience in industries where margins are thin because of foreign competition or maybe they are innately just not good at the type of activities that are profitable in today’s world.

Central banks affect job creating investment through interest rates. It may seem like small interest rate changes wouldn’t make a big difference for anyone once the effect propagates and is diluted across the whole economy. However, looking at it through the lens of cost of capital where businesses decide to do projects or not based on the expected profitability relative to borrowing costs, it is easy to see that the effect is highly unequal. This type of calculation implies a threshold, a cutoff where activities under a certain level of profitability are completely stopped. The fact that interest rates act as a threshold with regards to investment entails shutting down all lower margin activities, those that tend to be manned by people that are naturally disadvantaged.

This means that when central banks tighten too much, some workers may be afflicted moderately by a more difficult labor market but whole segments of the less productive and more vulnerable, may be completely cutoff from having a job.

The investment in equipment and buildings necessary to perform their work disappears. Major projects get cancelled in isolated and disadvantaged rural areas. Entry level positions that would be manned by the less experienced disappear. Jobs that require less education also go away.

People who, in good times are already paid less and have little capacity to bear a fall in revenue, don’t just bear a proportionate drop but a complete fall to zero with often only meager government welfare to fall back on. On top of the hit to dignity, it atrophies their skills and makes them further disadvantaged and vulnerable. In the next cycle, they’re likely to again be the first to be cutoff.

It’s difficult to overstate the utter cruelty of monetary mismanagement.

Re: The Unemployment Rate in Every Region of Europe

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does matter. Consider of a hypothetical country consisting of two equally large regions. One region is desert, only 10,000 people live there and unemployment rate is 20%. In the other region there are 1M people and the employment rate is 3%. Now if you look at the map, it seems that the country is doing pretty poorly. Half of the country has a bad employment rate. Whereas in reality it only affect a small portion…

> One region is desert, only 10,000 people live there > In the other region there are 1M people This has already been normalized: these are European NUTS-2 regions, which are drawn to contain roughly equal populations. Each NUTS-2 region is supposed to be 800k to 3 million people per region. It's not perfect, but it's not just geographical borders with wildly different populations. For example, London is split into 5…

> Each NUTS-2 region is supposed to be 800k to 3 million people per region. It's not perfect

It's far from perfect in some countries. The Community of Madrid with 6.5 million people is its own region (or Catalonia with 7.5 million); that's more than Scotland, which is cut up into five NUTS-2 regions. The Paris region (Île-de-France) has 12 million inhabitants, which is more than, say, Austria or Hungary or the Czech Republic, each cut up according to more or less traditional geographic divisions.

You have a point according to how NUTS should work, the grandparent does have a bit of a point according to what it's like in practice.

Post reply on HN