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I've spent the last two years building a new email client

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Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I think most users are far too tolerant of bad decisionmaking

They aren't tolerant at all to decisions they think are bad, they are just tolerant to ones that you think are bad.

So you're calling me not a potential user because I don't like the idea of something using 15% of my PCs memory, best case scenario.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half of Hackernews is discussion about six figure tech salaries, the other half is complaints about 300mb (aka ~$2) ram being to expensive for an app. https://www.anandtech.com/show/9864/price-of-ddr4-memory-dro...

> Half of Hackernews is discussion about six figure tech salaries, the other half is complaints about 300mb (aka ~$2) ram being to expensive for an app. Slashdot got like this eventually. Slashdot was tech site full of luddites complaining about anything new. Worse, slashdot stopped becoming relevant. When the top comment on an article about increased hard drive space was "why does all this stuff take so much space?…

> People need to stop micromanaging their computer

You're so wrong. This hogging literally causes micromanagement. I have to start closing browser tabs and maybe at some point my IDE or a few open files so that just Slack or Discord or some other piece of horrendously bloated software could hog up another half a gigabyte of RAM. When Eight gigabytes stop being enough because of some chat applications it's not okay. Calling people that think software can actually use resources meaningfully "luddites" is counterproductive and damaging to the entire PC ecosystem, RAM and disk space are limited resources on most PCs and people do not want and should not have to spend more just to run a few chat applications.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#563
post #321

The chat-like interface looks great! kudos!

Thanks!

having recently heard of autocrypt and delta.chat, I thought time is ripe for somebody to use this view in a regular email client. The demo video seemed to have exactly implemented this, I'm impressed.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm baffled as to why I have to queue for something that's neither a physical product nor a service platform. Doubly so when the link posted seems to just bump someone else up the queue. As a hacker news link it does strike me as a form of clickbait (and it honestly winds me up); "Hey HN! come look at this thing I've built that I'm not letting you look at!"

Since I am only one developer currently, and there will probably be bugs, I don't want thousands of people having the same bug, this is the reason I'm not releasing it right away.

This seems like a totally legitimate reason - but in that case maybe the announcement on HN (the tech website keeping the slashdot* effect alive) should have come once there was a public RC.

Also, if it's bugs and the reporting of that you're worried about, maybe publish a proper bugtracker (github is both adequate and free) rather than just an email address?

* slashdot effect; as in taking a webserver down just with the amount of people viewing it. Or to put it another way, if you wanted lots of people viewing your project, let them. If you don't, then don't advertise it to them!

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve reversed and broken real-life products written in JS, Java, WebAssembly and native code. Minified JS and obfuscated Java (DexGuard or ProGuard) are almost identical in complexity, you can restore the actual datatypes still, and you can even restore the rough outlines of where control structures were. Obfuscated WebAssembly, NaCl or native code is much worse to work with, and often data structures and control str…

I'd be very interested about your findings decompiling wasm. Do you have a blog, by chance?

I don’t maintain a blog currently, sorry. And if I had one I doubt I’d be able to write interesting articles about this topic.

Generally I share such info on IRC, and then it gets just forgotten over time.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you're not giving the nod to it -- you don't even know yet if it's any good or not -- you're only telling them about it because you've got something to gain yourself from doing so.

Yeah! Now you've got it! You're just telling people about something. It's not a big deal.

Spam is also "just telling people about something".

Imagine what the world would be like if everyone had the same attitude towards other people's attention and time as you do.

I'm sure this behaviour doesn't seem like a big deal to you because relatively few people are so inconsiderate.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#567
post #528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then don’t refer anyone. Or maybe only send to your friends who a new email client would interest? Is “hey, saw this on HN, this looks interesting” really going to hurt your reputation? He’s a dev trying to market, that’s all.

I was going to say this. It's totally optional to invite more people, so if it goes against your ethical views, just don't.

Yeah, but by engaging in this behavior, the dev has convinced me this whole thing is click spam, so I’m done evaluating it before I even downloaded it.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I see it, user's resources (and their experience related to these factors) aren't part of the calculus that goes into how most companies choose their platforms. To be fair, things have always been this way -- people have been writing good-but-bloated software in shitty frameworks since forever -- but I can't recall a time that one framework so bloated is so heavily in vogue. (edit: Flash, maybe? Though people…

I agree with you that efficient resource usage is pretty low on the priority list for a lot of development these days. I wish it wasn't too but that's a different discussion. Electron being in vogue does definitely compound this issue but the benefits from using it (e.g. cross OS development on a familiar platform & language many devs already know) seem to outweigh the resource problem.

There are many devs that know regular desktop development as well; Electron lets the project manager hire cheaper and more expendable web devs, or the ability to pile the job on their existing web devs, for their otherwise expensive desktop work.

Do any major code bootcamps teach C#, C++, or Java? Or is it all just webtech?

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you can help me understand the outcry over Electron memory usage, especially on HH. I can't remember the last time I ran out of memory on my laptop or desktop unintentionally. Seems to me battery life and jank should be main areas of focus. You can have a 2GB if you cut CPU usage and typing latency.

I've run out of memory a few times this week on my Linux VM at work, and also at home on the beater laptop I use in the living room. Those are both stuck at 4GB of RAM, though. On my laptop with 16GB, it's certainly been at least a few months since I've done anything that made it hit swap.

I said "unintentionally" as a hedge for corner cases like VMs where you are likely aware of the limits. I probably should have been more clear. I also prefer native apps, which is why I still mostly use Sublime over Code despite the latter's advantages. But it's because of speed and battery life, not memory consumption. If we're going to make a case for native apps, lets at least focus on the biggest pain points, as the proliferation of Electron indicates we're not making an impact.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#570

I put my name on the waitlist, but instantly lost interest and confidence by: “Jump forward 5 steps in the line for every person you invite and get beta access sooner.” Why? If the product is that good I’ll evangelize it. This is a desktop application, so I don’t see a big boost from a network effect. All this does makes me wonder if the product is more about building hype than value

You are not alone in this attitude, so don't take this personally, but I'm going to reply to you because you're the top comment. This is an incredibly destructive point of view. Promotion is essential to any software project, even open source, and in the vast majority of cases, word of mouth is not enough. This is an ethical, up-front, straightforward ask that costs you and anyone you might contact very little and is…

Top secret product built in stealth mode rarely achieves success.

Where are the boring products without dumb marketing techniques to generate hype, with actual things to show other than a waiting list?

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