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Bill Gates, Hero

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Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#121

Post by generalk »

gaius wrote: post #38
edw519 wrote: post #13

Why do you think Silicon Valley has never quite come around on this guy? Because of the trail of dead bodies and lost opportunities left in his wake. Let's not forget, Bill Gates was handed a 0th birthday gift of $1 million from his grandfather, the keys to his private middle school computer (the same one Stanford had), and a free ticket to do business with IBM because his mother already knew its chairman. Sure he wa…

Oh please! Michael Phelps was born with his flipper-like feet, does that make him any less of an Olympian? Genetic advantage, financial advantage, it's all the same. Gates did what he set out to do, a computer on every desktop and in every home. The economies of scale he made possible are why you can buy a PC for what, $300 now? He took computing out of the hands of the "high priests" and gave it to the masses. Would…

It certainly wouldn't be fully mainstream.

Really? I think that's discounting the booming home PC market that existed before Microsoft got involved and giving a lot of credit to someone for an achievement that wasn't fully there. All Gates did was ensure that his company's software was on every computer.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#122

Post by gaius »

calloc wrote: post #105
jakarta wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly, which he says is stupid. That's why Buffett and Gates have been pushing so hard to get other billionaires to pledge to donate as much as them. Larry Ellison is one of the more recent tech execs to take the pledge.

Last I read Larry makes 1.6 BILLION US DOLLARS a year. I don't think you can ever spend that much money.

Larry's taste includes fighter jets...

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#123

Post by raganwald »

calloc wrote: post #105
jakarta wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly, which he says is stupid. That's why Buffett and Gates have been pushing so hard to get other billionaires to pledge to donate as much as them. Larry Ellison is one of the more recent tech execs to take the pledge.

Last I read Larry makes 1.6 BILLION US DOLLARS a year. I don't think you can ever spend that much money.

Larry seems to take this as a challenge.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#124

Post by Gibbon »

sutro wrote: post #107
edw519 wrote: post #13

Why do you think Silicon Valley has never quite come around on this guy? Because of the trail of dead bodies and lost opportunities left in his wake. Let's not forget, Bill Gates was handed a 0th birthday gift of $1 million from his grandfather, the keys to his private middle school computer (the same one Stanford had), and a free ticket to do business with IBM because his mother already knew its chairman. Sure he wa…

I can't believe this is getting upvotes. Destroyed lives? Please. Get some perspective. And check your history. The guy bootstrapped Microsoft using nothing but sweat equity -- no investment, no inheritance -- working for years in very meager circumstances in New Mexico before getting some traction and moving to Washington. In short he lived the dream that many of us aspire to, and has probably helped his fellow man…

Indeed, Gates has likely helped create more billionaires and millionaires than anyone currently living.

Think of the ecosystem surrounding Microsoft: all of the hardware companies, peripherals, software, training, education and jobs that would not exist were it not for "a pc on every desktop." Not to mention the millions of people using Windows to run their businesses.

I might add also that Gates billions are not sitting in a vault. It gets invested and that capital is used by others to create their own empires.

Wealth is fractal. A major success can generate an explosion of wealth further down the chain.

Wether you agree with Billy Boy's tactics or not, it's petty to call him "evil".. he's had made an immeasurable impact on the world and done so in a way that directly or indirectly changed the lives of millions of people.

To fault him for giving away his fortune? Well that's just a whole other level of absurdity. He's under no obligation to give it away, and yet he is. One might argue over the efficacy of his plans, but surely humanity will benefit in the end.

The real questions are: Is it better to give away your wealth incrementally or in one lump sum at the end? Is more taxation better or less? Is a monopoly more effective at wealth creation or is a more diverse market better? It's impossible to answer.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#125

Post by lefstathiou »

I am rather grateful for Gates' contribution to the software industry. Standardizing the development environment was monumental toward facilitating innovation in software development. Imagine if Steve Jobs controlled the industry with as much power that Gates did, how much different would the world be? While I dont like to deal in "IF's," if we judge people/organizations by their actions, Microsoft has always been a relatively open environment whereas today Apple continues to tyranically control their platform. Seeing Apple rule would have sucked for everyone.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#126

Post by mgkimsal »

calloc wrote: post #105
jakarta wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly, which he says is stupid. That's why Buffett and Gates have been pushing so hard to get other billionaires to pledge to donate as much as them. Larry Ellison is one of the more recent tech execs to take the pledge.

Last I read Larry makes 1.6 BILLION US DOLLARS a year. I don't think you can ever spend that much money.

pretty easy to spend that buying a few private jets and yachts. 1.6 billion ain't what it used to be.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#127

Post by jacobolus »

mattmaroon wrote: post #95
edw519 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...but this part above strikes me as petty... Sorry if it came across that way; that was not my intent. Everyone's starting point is relative. No one ever gave me the gifts that Bill Gates got. But then again, I've had gifts that 99% of everyone who ever lived couldn't imagine. With those gifts comes responsibility. Whenever I have an opportunity to use my gifts to do good things, I think of how proud those who made…

From your comments its clear that you're zealously anti-capitalist and, as a result, anti-Microsoft, so you're simply not applying logic. Bill Gates did his legal duty. When you run a corporation you have a fiduciary responsibility to it. He would be doing something immoral if he didn't do what was best for Microsoft. The theory behind free market capitalism is that enough companies doing the same will average out to…

> The theory behind free market capitalism is that enough companies doing the same will average out to the best results.

You left out the part about how this only works if (a) the market is actually “free” and “competitive” (what this means is a complicated topic beyond the scope of this text box), and (b) the interests of the company and the interests of the broader society are aligned. (Which is why we have all sorts of specialized regulation of companies, various kinds of guaranteed rights attached to consumers and contract-signers and so on, a court system, and ultimately elections). In the specific case of Microsoft in the 1980s and 1990s, they clearly were not. The idea that Microsoft’s corporate strategy embodied some kind of Adam Smith small-firms-in-a-competitive-market ideal is hogwash. Notice that Microsoft’s actions were found to be illegal in several court battles.

It is definitely not a company’s fiduciary duty to break the law.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#128

Post by tsycho »

pavs wrote: post #118
kenjackson wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Selling your stock over being fired is not a principled stand. At least not in the conventional way of thinking about it. Plus he has on occassion been labelled the highest paying CEO in the world, due to his stock options. http://www.forbes.com/lists/2007/12/lead_07ceos_Steven-P-Job... And in any case, most CEOs don't make a HUGE salary. Jobs would probably get paid $750k. The fact that he doesn't make this money is…

> And in any case, most CEOs don't make a HUGE salary. You should check out the banking industry.

Actually, even in the banking industry, most CEOs have a salary between $0.6-1 million/year. The real money is in the bonus.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#129

Post by yosho »

edw519 wrote: post #66
lionhearted wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's not forget, Bill Gates was handed a 0th birthday gift of $1 million from his grandfather, the keys to his private middle school computer (the same one Stanford had), and a free ticket to do business with IBM because his mother already knew its chairman. The rest of your post is very insightful, but this part above strikes me as petty - I was low born myself, was given almost nothing except birth in the USA in…

...but this part above strikes me as petty... Sorry if it came across that way; that was not my intent. Everyone's starting point is relative. No one ever gave me the gifts that Bill Gates got. But then again, I've had gifts that 99% of everyone who ever lived couldn't imagine. With those gifts comes responsibility. Whenever I have an opportunity to use my gifts to do good things, I think of how proud those who made…

I completely agree.

Paris Hilton was also given a lot of freebies early in life...looked how that one turned out.

Early advantages don't always produce exceptional results, often times it can lead to the exact opposite.

Re: Bill Gates, Hero

#130

Post by TGJ »

edw519 wrote: post #66
lionhearted wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's not forget, Bill Gates was handed a 0th birthday gift of $1 million from his grandfather, the keys to his private middle school computer (the same one Stanford had), and a free ticket to do business with IBM because his mother already knew its chairman. The rest of your post is very insightful, but this part above strikes me as petty - I was low born myself, was given almost nothing except birth in the USA in…

...but this part above strikes me as petty... Sorry if it came across that way; that was not my intent. Everyone's starting point is relative. No one ever gave me the gifts that Bill Gates got. But then again, I've had gifts that 99% of everyone who ever lived couldn't imagine. With those gifts comes responsibility. Whenever I have an opportunity to use my gifts to do good things, I think of how proud those who made…

There is perceived responsibility that comes with those gifts. He could have just blown the money and everyone would have moved on.

Plus your next statement is just baloney. The greater good? You mean the good that would have affected you? The man can do with his money as he sees fit, who are you to tell him what to do or judge him when he does it.

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